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cetnici - 72894 - 18.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

Početak bratoubilačkog rata


Našoj Ravnoj gori je pretio slom. Četnici su tad bili "petmetkovići" i manje...

Milan Kalabić, koji je izjavio da će lično ubiti sina Nikolu Kalabća, bio je jedan od komandanata Milana Nedića. On je lično prihvatio razbijenog Vučka Ignjatovića i predao mu komandu nad svojim jedinicama, jer je iskusan gerilac.

U pomoć dolazi kralj svih četnika Kosta Pećanac.(1) Dolazi i Mita Ljotić. Nikola Kalabić, očajan zbog nedostatka municije, odlazi ocu Milanu. Milan vadi pištolj na sina: "Pucaj, pucaj, bolje ti, nego da me ubiju crveni! Pušta suzu i grli sina!

Milan Kalabić od Nemaca vabi osam kamiona municije, da bi se tukao sa crvenima. Svih osam kamiona se istovara na Ravnoj gori.

E, onda počinje "Alo Požega, cico lezi! Gaženje crvenih sas srbijanski opanci...

Uključuju se Nemci, Nedić od četnika traži puštanje Nemaca i dobija ga. Crveni tek su u Foči stali.

Partizani izmislili da su "veliki borci za ranjenike" a na Zlatiboru na Palisadu ostavili više od 500 ranjenika!

Nemci sve ranjenike gaze tenkovima! Partizani nam dolaze u Srbiju preko Raške oblasti, tek sa Pekom kad Rusi bejase u Turn Severinu.

Danas na Palisadu imućni gaze po nekadašnjem stratištu partizana, ostavljenih ranjenika.

Porodica Kalabić je krvavo platila onih osam kamiona municije. Svi su sem Nikole zatočeni na Banjici. Milana su Nemci vukli po staklu, dok mu utroba nije ispala. Ako to nešto znači, Milan Kalabic je umirao lagano ali nije krik pustio.

Vučka Ignjatijevića, komandanta Požege , ubijaju Ljotićevci u Novoj Varoši 1942. godine.

Nikoli Kalabiću u Bosni ubijaju sina od 15 godina, mislim "Kurjakovi majevički partizani".

Nikolu Kalabića crveni ubijaju u zasedi u okolini Valjeva, i na samrti Nikola ih je izradio i ratnu torbu uspeo da ćušne u septičku jamu nekog seljaka. Uspeo da sačuva saradnike od Udbinih ubica. Taj seljak nalazi torbu 1962. godine i nosi je UDBI ali više nije bila upotrebljiva. Ni njemu se ne zna za grob, sve ostalo su laži udbe.

Komunisti su vodali i nekog glumca iz Valjeva i prikazivali ga kao Nikolu. Na slici, taj glumac stoji pokraj Mande, opakog partizana. Manda je bio visok 165, pa ako je po slici Nikola ima 170 cm visinu, a dobro je poznato da je on bio gorostas iz našeg plemena "Drobnjaka" i da je bio visok 195 cm. Na toj slici "Dražinih hvatača" jedan partizan ima šmajser sa nakrivljenom cevi, koji su Nemci pravili u maloj seriji za gradske borbe u Ukrajini. Ta klapa da se privuče Draži i da ga zezne? Lažu crveni kao psi!


(1)Kosta Pećanac je bio čovek bez čijih akcija nikad ne bi mogao biti probijen Solunski front i odneta je brza srpska pobeda. Dobijen je 1. svetski rat u trenutku kada su Engleska i Francuska sa penkalom krenuli na potpis separatnog mira. Srbi su tada promjenili tok istorije!

Nemački kajzer je napisao buugarskom kralju: "Izgubili smo rat zbog 60 hiljada srpskih vojnika? Sramota! Neviđena sramota. Neviđena sramota...
seselj - 72890 - 18.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

O saradnji Draže i Tita


Malo se loše razumesmo. Mislio sam na Veslački klub "Zvezda" na Adi Ciganliji...

Deda nek počiva u miru, to ćemo privatno.

Komandant je major Vučko Ignjatović, on je crvene provalio prvi da će udariti u leđa i da sanjaju crvenu republiku, Valjevac je rodom... I Vučko je zaista i napravio dobru zasedu posle - minirao most i postavio dva mitraljeska gnezda. Sastanak je bio u selu Brajići polovinom oktobra 1941. godine.

Tada je Vučka Ignjatovića, komandanta Požege izdao kapetan Glišić koji se uplašio obećanog streljanja od Draže.

Dalje, ispred zasede izlazi pred Tita i Čačanina Minića i spasava psa i po drugi put...

Epilog: VUČKO je besneo što Draža daje Užice crvenima, zbog fabrike municije koja im je trebala ko leb, a već početkom novembra, počinje krvavi građanski rat. Ipak, pre toga Vučko stiže da likvidira Milana Blagojevića koji nije hteo da isporuči municiju po dogovoru važećem sa "Struganika".. .. Crvena banda znajući četničku situaciju sa municijom, napada iz Užica svom žestinom i na Požegu koja tad pade. I Čačak i konačno ugroziše "Ravnu goru". Nemci su se zaustavili i pustili da se ustanici prorede.
raspad_juge - 72888 - 18.08.2012 : Jovan Vlasenica - best (1)

Tragična sudbina srpskog naroda


Malo osećam bez veze jer ispade da polemišem sa srpskim dobrovoljcem Novakom.

U gotovo svakom tekstu koji napisah uvijek ističem tragičnu nestašicu ljudstva kod nas, tako da sam ono malo dobrovoljaca što je dolazilo iz Srbije uvijek doživljavao s pijetetom i ogromnim poštovanjem.

Naročito mi emocije proradiše kad si spomenuo Mostarce (bez njih se Nevesinje nikad ne bi moglo održati) i njihovu tragičnu sudbinu posle rata i definitivni rastanak s Mostarom i ognjištem.

Nešto poput sudbine sarajevskih Srba.


Od devedesetih pa do sada u meni se stvorila velika antipatija prema dinastiji Karađorđević i smatram ih glavnim krivcima za srpsku golgotu i u 2 svjetskom ratu, ali i ovom posljednjem. Kad su ismijavali Šešelja za isticanje granice Karlovac-Ogulin-Karlobag obični neupućeni Srbin je mislio da Šešelj lupeta jer je rijetko ko znao da su to bile granice koje su zapadni saveznici iz 1 svjetskog rata ponudili Srbiji.

Međutim, to Aleksandru bješe malo, jer je htio još i Zagorje.

Generalno, nesrećna sudbina Čiče, nestanak ravnogorskog pokreta, doživotna emigracija preostalih živih ravnogoraca je samo tragična refleksija odluka iz 1918...

P.S. Neka mi urednik Željko Tomić ne zamjeri, ali bi ja ostao anoniman na portalu iako u mom mjestu Jovane na prste možeš nabrojati.

Jovane, brate, svaka ti je Njegoševa!

Pozdrav od Željka sa Sokoca!
poginuli - 72886 - 18.08.2012 : Nebojsa Buha Subotica - best (0)

Branislav (Tihomir) Buha


Branislav (Tihomir) Buha je poginuo kao borac Vojske Republike Srpske u Sarajevu, naselje Nedžarići. Ubijen je kukavički, snajperom u jutro 14. juna 1992. godine. Iza sebe je ostavio suprugu Gordanu i sinove Peđu i Tihomira. Uvjek ćeš živjeti u našim srcima.
cetnici - 72884 - 17.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

O četništvu 90-tih godina


Devedesetih godina prošlog veka došlo je do devalvacije četništva, poput srpskog dinara.

Napominjem i da je ekipa kojoj sam se pridružio posle povlačenja bez borbe isto šešeljevska, ekipa normalnih boraca, vojničkog a ne folklornog karaktrera. To je bila jedinica kapetana Kule, ekipa za ponos i diku Srbije!

To nisi mogao videti na suđenju Voji, već samo neposredno. Bez gvozdene discipline nema rata, nema pobeda, samo haos, dezorganizacija, povlačenja bez borbi, a na kraju i povlačenja u stilu "trči lola, trči"...

Zapadna Slavonija je dozivela upravo to!

A narod koji je birao brkatog šefa policijske stanice provincije, za VODJU, odveden je na Sremsku Raču. Moj Jovo Ratku Mladiću svaki dan palte sveće za zdravlje!
prepiska - 72882 - 17.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (2)

O Titu i Draži


Nisam ja Jole ljut na tebe, mada u meni ima dosta jarosti. Iako više nisam siguran "komu i čemu sve pripada..."

Djedovi nam verovatno i sarađivaše, moj je bio u Bajni Bašti, Požega. Komandant Đ je svojevremeno sa svojim ljudima upao u Dražin štab, na sastanak sa Titom, bejaše tu i Miloš Minić i Đilas...

Došao je da ubije psa Tita...

Lično je mučeni Draža i samo Draža stao pred cev, pominjao oficirsku reč i na kraju samo preko njega mrtvog... Komandant reče: Požegu mi preći neće, ovde si ti, tamo sam ja videćemo kako će u Užice...

Kažu da se osećao smrad, Tito ili Minić? Đilas se sigurno nije "usro!"

A Tito i Minić tužilac, montiraše suđenje, drogirase Dražu da bi bio rasejan i nepovezan da ih ne rasturi i demistifikuje na suđđenju, i rasuše mu kosti da ih niko nikada više ne nađe.

Iako je na Adi bačen septičku jamu, sa krečanom u neposrednoj blizini, bačen u izmet njegovih saboraca.. . Ako nije premeštan. Danas je to livada iza Zvezdinog veš kluba i restorančića jednog!

Al' imamo mi komisiju...

I Bog je kaznio Dražu što je spasio demona Tita, koji je kasnije kukao što je kod Draže ponuđen samo rakijom, a zamisli tako mu se "jela gibanica". Kakav pas!
prepiska - 72880 - 17.08.2012 : Vogošćanin Pravi Vogošća - best (0)

Kako sam pucao na Sarajevo


Poštovani Stari,

kao prvo, da ti se izinem zbog toga što sam te pogrešno razumio pitanje koje si mi postavio u prethodnom tekstu.

Pošto u tvom članku u kojem spominješ intervju Bore Stjepanovića, nisi konkretno naveo svoje mišljenja, ja sam pogrešno shvatio tvoj komentar. Pročitao sam ja taj interviu, zato sam i napisao da ne vjerujem da je istinit, jer se u njemu pišu nevjerovatne stvari.

Rafali se toku rata nisu bili ispaljivani ni u vrata muslimanskih kuća i stanova a kamo li onima kojima dolaziše da ih mobilišeš kao svoje buduće borce! Helikopterom do Beograda se nije moglo slučajno letjeti, sem ako nisi imao debelu vezu u vojnom ili civilnom vrhu!

I tako, dok su drugi ratovali i ginuli za svoj narod, Bora je dobio dozvolu da vodi studente iz zemlje koja je u ratu i za to dobio pozamašne dnevnice, od kojih je mogao pola novca da odvoji, tj. pošalje svome bratu u Sarajevo. Taj novac je dobio od istih onih ljudi na koje sada laje da mu nisu izašli u susret.

Zbog nebuloza koje su napisane u tom tekstu, on mi izgleda kao da je neko napisao da prestavi srpsku stranu na najgori mogući način, zbog čega sumnjam da je interviu napisan onako kakav je trebao biti.

U mom prethodnom tekstu nisam htio da komentariše Boru jer mi njegov izgleda nestvarno i nelogično, i ne vjerujem da on može pričati ovakve nebuloze! Ukoliko postoji filmski zapis tog intervjua sa Borom Stjepanovićem volio bih da ga pogledam i samo ću tada povjerovati da je on to stvarno izjavio, jer samo glup čovjek može tako nešto da priča, a meni ne liči da taj mali čovječuljak može da sebi dozvoli da ispadne baš toliko glup.

Zbog toga sam pomislio da si ti podržao taj interviu i zbog toga ga spomenuo da ga i mi pročitamo, kako bi isprovocirao Srbe na ovom sajtu, što je kod mene odmah upalilo pa sam se u mom tekstu obratio tebi i pomenuo i Emira Kusturicu, kao odgovor na interviu od "Bore Srbina" ili kako on za sebe kaže, "Jugoslovena".

Boro nije ni Srbin ni Jugosloven, jer su i Jugosloveni kao i svi građani bivše Jugoslavije bili zaklete patriote da će da brane svaki pedalj zemlje i ako zatreba za nju dati svoj život!

Aaa ha ha ha haaaaaaa.. .. .

Ako je ovo istina što tamo piše, onda je Bora Stjepanović jedno veliko "NEVIĐENO GOVNO", koje ne zaslužuje gostoprimstvo ni u jednoj državi bivše Jugoslavije! Treba da ostane mali kakav i jeste, po izgledu, pameti i po ulogama koje je dobijao u svojoj dugoj "glumačkoj karijeri"!

Moj prethodni tekst je bio moje viđenje, zašto je bio rat, zašto se trbalo ratovati a ujedno i kontra na taj interviu koji si ti spomenuo!!!
softver - 72875 - 17.08.2012 : Marjan Todorovic Beograd - best (0)

XP problem


Pozdrav,

instalirao sam XP i sada, kada treba da skidam neki program sa neta i hoću da ga instaliram on mi pokazuje neki problem. Ja ne znam šta bi to moglo da bude pa da li neko može da mi pomogne?

Marjene,

kompjuter može pokazivati na hiljade problema, a ja ti mogu pomoći samo ukoliko mi napišeš koju si poruku dobio.

P.S. Uradi sve što si uradio i prošli put pa ćeš imati šansu da postaviš još jedno pitanje.
ilijas_nemanjici - 72860 - 17.08.2012 : Velimir Adžić Ilijaš - best (6)

Pjesma: Sjećam se


Zoran Zimbo Dragutinović je napisao ovu pjesmu i meni je dostavio. Uz njegovu dozvolu je objavljujem na ovom forumu, a isto tako na njegovo zadovoljstvo ću je uzeti u dopunjeno izdanje svoje knjige "Ilijaški Nemanjići".

"SJECAM SE"

Kada su nas protjerali 96-e,
Bio sam tada, recemo dijete,
Al sjećam se dobro tog dana,
Jer tada na srcu stvori se rana.

Sjećam se, mnogi su suze lili,
Mnogi ljudi tužni su bili,
I ja sam mnoge pustio suze,
Jer neka me strašna tuga obuze.

Sjećam se, tužno je tata rekao,
U mom životu nešto sam stekao,
Al' danas sve tu izgubih lako,
Pa koji čovjek ne bi zaplako.

Petnaest godina od tada je prošlo,
I nikad ono "bolje" nije došlo,
Neće nikad sigurno ni doći,
Džaba su u to uprte oči.

Sjećam se tebe moj Ilijašu,
Ovo pišem za tebe i raju našu,
A ti se sjeti uvijek te raje,
I neka naša ljubav vječno traje...!

Dragutinović Zoran
prepiska - 72854 - 16.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

O Šešeljevcima


Jadno i nekorektno, je da neko koga je Momčilo Đujić ražalovao, i optužio za izdaju, pljuje na sve dobrovoljačke formacije koje nisu njegove...

Čija li je starija: pokojnog Momčila Đujića ili Voje Šešelja?

Na početku je Jovo imao nas 60-tak sa Severa Marakane, i nije tada bilo ni Vučića, ni predsednika...

Pokojni Šuca i ostali se vratiše Arkanu, mene više nikakva politika nije interesovala...

U Nevesinju kad se pojaviše bili su strah i trepet i Srbima i muslimanima.. . Bili su tu dok se izblačilo sdk bankosave i neke parinje, a prodavala se i neka bela tehnika.. . I odose, na krvavim muslimansko hrvatskim napadima na Nevesinje nešto ih ne beše.. .

Koji je motiv imao Voja da pljuje po izuzetno časnoj jedinici Ćićolina, jedinici hrabrih, obrijanih, ošišanih momaka, koji su uglavnom ostalih bez ičega u Mostaru?

Naravno da je u njegovoj formaciji bilo i dobrih i časnih boraca ali bilo je i dosta onih koji su izgledali kao da sakupljeni ispred dragstora...

Na snimku "Zločin Voćin 1/3" , mozete videti jednog uhvaćenog nesrećnika, Dorćolac stari, pa obratite pažnju na stajling...

Kažes najčasniji dobrovoljci... Onda ću ja sebe pisati u nečasne. Samo opušteno!
seselj - 72844 - 16.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

O Šešeljevcima


Vuk je izdajnik, to je van svake priče!

Sve ovo o čemu ovde komentarišemo je vrlo diskutabilno i mnogo toga niti je sve belo niti je crno.

U Zapadnoj Slavoniji sam neko vreme bio u ekipi kapetana Kule, I on je bio neki šešeljevac, ali borci kremen kamen, svi obrijani, većinom Novosađani. Sa njima sam doživeo i najlepšu borbu u Kamenskom, nas 40 njih 400. Nedavno mi priznao jedan ujka, u priči na jednom forumu, a koji mi beše direktno suprotstavljen, da nikada nije doživeo takvu bitku.

A pre toga na pauzi u Voćinu od sat vremena, stojim na sred puta okrenut ka Zvečevu, automat mi spusten niz ruku, besan sam zbog povlačenja bez borbe, tako zamišljen neko vreme. Čujem neku galamu i okrećem se neki baba i deda, deda posrnuo a tri magarca ga guraju i psuju, dva maskirana i jedan samo zarasli. Opovah im sve čega se setih. Digoše puške meni na grudi, opsovaše mi majku ustašku, uz povik "ti ih štitiš" sad ćutim, nemam vremena da trgnem pusku, ali sreća neki drugari videli pa trče sa stepeništa neke kuće pa njima cevi u potiljak. Kažu nećemo braćo između sebe! Nabodoh jednog, razvadiše nas i uskoro odosmo svojim putem. Pričali su ekavicom, a kasnije sam neke prepoznao u Beogradu, ne ove puškare, ali ekipa je ekipa.

Dobar deo te ekipe je izgledao poput pokupljenih alkosa ispred Dragstora. Naravno, čast izuzecima.

U 2007. godini Šešelj pljuje u nekoj knjizi po nekim momcima iz Mostara, osnivačima Čičoline, jedinice kojoj sam i ja pripadao. E, ta jedinica je bila časna i poštena, i u njeno ime ću bre i sada odmah da ginem. Pljuvao je "Bele orlove", Arkanovce, a i među njima znam dosta dobrih ljudi. Nije u pravu pa da je triput vojvoda!
dejton - 72840 - 16.08.2012 : Spiro Novi Banovci - best (1)

Bilo pa prošlo


Nemam namjeru da polemišem sa gospodinom Novakom, ali bih volio da shvati što sam htio da kažem kad sam postavio vijest o Jojinom hapšenju.

Nema ništa protiv Joje a ni protiv bilo koga od tadašnjih "vlastodržaca" u Vogošći. Bilo pa prošlo! Ipak, hoću da gospodina Novaka upoznam sa nekim stvarima o ljudima koji su za vrijeme rata vedrili i oblačili u Vogošći i glumili velike Srbe, ali su svoju djecu još prije prvog metka sklonili u Srbiju, a djeca onih nešto "manjih" Srba su ratovala i ginula za Republiku Srpsku.

Kad je potpisan Dejtonski sporazum i kad su Srbi iz Vogošće, Ilijaša i drugih dijelova Srpskog Sarajeva krenuli u egzodus, postojao je neki dogovor ili odluka, ne znam čija, da se kamioni za prevoz stvari prvo obezbjede familijama poginulih boraca. S obzirom da sam dugo godina prije rata ribario na Drini i Drinjači, Srbi iz mjesta Zelinje kod Drinjače obezbjedili su mi kuću za stanovanje - srpsku kuću. O ovome sam već ranije pisao. I dok sam čekao kamion, dok su iste dobijali privatnici vulkanizeri, trgovci, kafedžije, ja ostah u Semizovcu sa pokojnom suprugom jer nisam imao novaca da platim prevoz.

Odem jedan dan na Pale i poslije nekoliko sati čekanja gospodin Joja me napokon primi i kad sam rekao zbog čega sam došao, on vadi novčanik i kaže mi da trenutno nema novca, kao da sam ja prosjak i došao od njega da tržim milostinju. Ostao sam u Semizovcu do 13. juna 1996. godine kad je grupa vojnika tkzv. armije BiH predvodjenja sinom mog bivseg komšije Nailom Gajevicem upala u moj stan, prebila mene i pokojnu mi suprugu i dali nam rok od 5 minuta da napustimo Semizovac inače ce nas pobiti.

Gospodine Novače, da vam se dogodilo nešto slično kako bi ste reagovali i šta biste mislili o tim našim "velikim" Srbima koji danas sa svojim sinovima uživaju po Srbiji, osnivaju zavičajna udruženja i opet pjevaju istu pjesmu, a moj jedinac i još hiljade takvih počivaju na vojičkim grobljima širom Republike Srpske.
trazim - 72838 - 16.08.2012 : Dragica Novi Sad - best (0)

Tražim prijatelja


Poštovani,

ako neko od vas poznaje KrstoviĆ Milana i Milanku imali su ćerku Jadranku kada smo se upoznali u francuskom u gradu Lilu. Oni su se vratili u SFRJ a mi smo tamo ostali još nekoliko godina. Od tada se nismo čuli pa bi vas molila da ukoliko ih neko poznaje da ostavi poruku bila bi vam zahvalna Dragica Novi Sad.

Dragice,

osnovno pravilo ovog foruma je da obavezno ostaviš email ukoliko nekoga tražiš. To zbog toga što veliki broj osoba koje se traže kontaktiraju mene, a ja ne mogu da im dam kontakt.

Pored toga, trabala si da napišeš iz kojeg grada bivše Jugoslavije su bili Milanka i Milan Krstović. To bi, u svakom slučaju, pomoglo da se oni pronađu.

Kao treće, postavila si ovaj tekst u rubriku "Novosti" a ja moram da ga prebacim u "Tražim", što vjerovatno znači da ga nećeš moći naći.
montevideo - 72836 - 16.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

O našem glumcu


Stari na kraju sam ipak ukucao i pročitao intervju svim novinama kojima je dao i svaki je bogatiji i bogatiji. Mislio sam da želiš da me rasplačeš granatiranjem Sarajeva...

Šta reći o našem "velikom" glumcu.Ja bih prvo zakukao što je u drami "Bife Titanik Bogdan Diklić na kraju pucao ćorcima.

Kaže Mladić rekao "rastresite im mozak"? A u stvari kum Žoržo mu je nalazio Rumune koji su mu rastresali deo tela na kom je sedeo pišući knjige Gluma 1, 2. i 3. i udžbenik jedan po jedan... I Gluma svi na jedan...

Grehota je komentarisati, što bi rekli "faca ga odaje" pa nije ni čudo. Sve je to odgumio za apanažu od 2-3 hiljade evra, da ne bi snimao reklamu za Grand kafu.

Moram priznati da posle ovog intervjua, ni bubašvabe ni zmije nisu tako gadne!
zaboravljeni - 72834 - 16.08.2012 : Velimir Adžić Ilijaš - best (0)

Glišić (Stojana) Goran


Za Dragana Grčić - Beograd,

Dragane, nema nikakvih nedoumica za pomenutog Gorana. Evo ti po ko zna koji put podaci o njemu.

Glišić (Stojan) Goran

pripadnik Samostalnog voda 5. pb. Ilijaške brigade, rođen 1964. godine u Ajdanovićima. Poginuo 07. 08. 1992. godine u Ajdanovićima. Autom naišao na zasjedu gdje je smrtno ranjen. Sahranjen je u groblju u Ajdanovićima. Posmrtno odlikovan 1994. godine Medaljom zasluga za narod.
seselj - 72824 - 16.08.2012 : Jovan Vlasenica - best (1)

Šešeljevci su bili najčasniji srpski dobrovoljci


Mislim da je jadan i nekorektan nastup gospodina Novaka u komentaru o Šešeljevcima. Kao da sam čitao kolumnu Vuka Draškovića.

Pošto sam i ja unuk ravnogorca i mogu da sudim.

Spominješ istočnu Bosnu i brljanja Šešeljavaca. Koliko je meni poznato samo su bili u Zvorniku prilikom zauzimanja grada i nikad više nisam čuo da su bili u Podrinju. Uvijek smo tragično kuburili sa ljudstvom i vapili smo za dobrovoljcima koji su se samo sporadično pojavljivali u malim grupama (max 5) i to rijetko, a posle 1993 nikako.

Za čitav istočni dio Republike Srpske znam da je bila samo jedna prava jedinica s dobrovoljcima i to Aleksićevi junaci na jevrejskom groblju. To je ta agresija Srbije na BiH. Samo je jednom Srbija aktivno učestvovala u Podrinju u januaru 1993. kad su muslimani zauzeli Skelane (16. januar) i praktično došli pred Bajnu Baštu i s tog aspekta su na neki način i imali legitimitet za intervenciju.

Na suđenju Šešelju za Zvornik, ko je pratio suđenje jasno se pokazalo da Šešeljevci nisu napravili nikakve zločine u Zvorniku.

U slučaju Voćina pokazalo se da zločine nad hrvatskim civilima nisu počinili Šešeljevi dobrovoljci već domaći Srbi.

Prilikom borbi za Vukovar odred "leva Supoderica" (Šešeljevci) je uz Gardijsku brigadu i Arkanovce bio srpska udarna pesnica.

Za razliku od raznih manekena koji su dolazili na vikend ratovanje,Šeljevci su dolazili da časno pomognu i nisu izigravali nikakve manekene već mjesecima časno držali linije. Ko je pratio suđenje Šešelju, mogao je to i da vidi.

Kad su dolazili u Trebinje Šešeljevci su spavali u kasarni s vojskom, dok su Draškovićevi "baletani" naravno odsjeli u hotelu.

Kad već spominjem ovog ljigavca Vuka Draškovića moram da dodam i jednu činjenicu. Omamljen ravnogorskom pričom ovog šljama i izroda, kao klinac sam se u sam osvit rata (1991. godine) učlanio u SPO. To je vjerovatno uticalo da nikad nisam bio član SDS-a i da sam uvijek imao neki animozitet prema njima.

P. S. Nikad nisam bio ni član radikala. Samo sam spletom okolnosti ispratio cijelo suđenje Voji i saznao mnoštvo činjenica i detalja koje nisam znao. Vrhunac je bilo svjedočenje hrvatskog vojnika koji je preživio Ovčaru. Prilikom unakrsnog ispitivanja u nekoliko navrata se svjedok osmjehivao, stvoren je pozitivni dijalog svjedoka i Voje i na kraju je čak i svjedok, doduše indirektno, potvrđivao Vojine teze da on nema nikakve veze s odmazdom na Ovčari.

Kad se sjetim Voje, nekada su ga se muslimani bojali kao guje, a danas svaki dan slušamo muslimanske prijetnje tipa "cipele s blatom".
hadzici - 72812 - 16.08.2012 : Sasa Hadžići - best (0)

Stupnik


Znam da ih je na položajima Armije BiH ostalo oko 13, ali ne znam koliko ih je poginilo u povlačenju. To me interesuje.
zaboravljeni - 72809 - 16.08.2012 : Dragana Grčić Beograd - best (1)

Glišić (Stojan) Goran


Poštovani gospodine Tomiću,

Goran ( Stojan ) Glišić 1963 - 1992Vidim da ima nedoumica oko odlikovanja za poginulog borca Glišić (Stojan) Gorana. Imam podatke iz "Monografije poginulih pripadnika MUP-a Republike Srpske 1992-1995. " gdje piše da je pomenuti Goran Odlikovan Medaljom zasluga za narod. Ako je potrebno mogu Vam skenirati i poslati.

Srdačan pozdrav!

Dragana,

hvala na ponudi, ali nema potrebe. Već odavno znam da je odlikovan. Umjesto toga, bio bih ti zahvalan da nešto više napišeš o njemu - otiđi na njegovu stranicu i klikni na unos poruke.

Srdačan pozdrav,
Željko Tomić
prepiska - 72806 - 16.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

Joja


Čoveka ne poznajem ni njegov lik ni delo, tako da ne bih polemisao o njegovoj prošlosti. Međutim, činjenica je da se preko njega napadaju faktički prekodrinske Srbe.

Da je Joja i najgori čovek na svetu, sada kada je u bukagijama, nije viteški kamenom na njega. Ako je toliko loš čovek, reče li mu ko za vreme njegovog zemana, nemoj Joja tako, kud ćeš Joja, ne valja tako Joja.. .. Usprotivi li mu se ko?

Samo ko mu se tada usprotivio može , i sada loše o njemu. A ako je bilo gde si Joja care, Joja vojvodo, Joja legendo... onda danas retroaktivno je bespredmetna priča.

Ako je Joja loš, lošiji su oni od njega koji ga grliše, ljubiše i podržavaše. Napominjem Špiro da ne pomisliš opet da bilo šta od ovih reči ima sa tobom! Jednostavno je, ako je bio loš i cela Vogošća to zna? Što ga pustiste da "lošuje"

Nisam nikad rekao jadni Joja već nesretni Joja. I ako je Joji opsovana familija, ako si Joja pucao ruka ti se pozlatila!
prepiska - 72802 - 16.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (2)

RE: Kako sam pucao iz Sarajeva


Neću stari pogledati taj snimak "Kako sam pucao na Sarajevo"! Neću zbig tiga što je Sarajevo bilo najveći logor za Srbe u prošlom ratu. Kada je nekom muslimanu ćeif, on upadne u srpski stan pa siluje kolje ili prebija. I nikm ništa! Neću zbog jame Kazani. Neću zbog 8500 pobijenih Srba u Sarajevu, o kojima se ćuti i zbog njih se niko ne procesuira dok se Srbima sude za svaki šamar. Za žive koji se vode zaklani, pa na sudu i svedoče u sudnici da ih čovek nije zaklao, a sudija "bež hajvane, vidim ja dobro da si zaklan..."

Vogošćanin ti dade odgovor... "ne bi' ja tu ništa dir'o.. .. "

Sećam se na radiju BiH 1994. godine nisi nista srpsko mogao čuti! Ništa, sem onog panonskog govnara. Naravno pesma je "krivi smo mi putuj Evropo". Kao autor je dobar ali kao čovek ni do podne. Interplanetarna slina.. .. .. Blizo stari, jel mi želiš poručiti "krivi smo mi"?

Znaš li da je BiH ozna i DB od 1956, pritiscima i progonima, fingiranim optužbama proterala 350 000 hiljada Srba u Srbiju? Lažem li blizo stari? Dolaskom na vlast Slobodana Miloševića, tome se stalo na put.

"Vogošćanska grupa" sećas li se progona tih ljudi? Fingiranih optužnica za neprijateljsku delatnost? Ima Nolo tefterče, i nešto će i pustiti na ovaj sajt istine, jer ovde dolazimo na izvor i mi Srbi i muslimani, kao na izvor jer svuda je medijska blokada. Svuda mutna voda!
montevideo - 72800 - 15.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit,USA - best (2)

Bora Stjepanović


O Bori Stjepanoviću sam do sada imao neutralno mišljenje. Onako sićušan i zbunjen, veoma dobro glumi uloge slabašnih ljudi koji se veoma loše snalaze u društvu. U njegovim ulogama uglavnom susrećem osobe lošeg karaktera, koje sa puno muke ostvaruju najobičnije životne ciljeve.

Izgleda da Stjepanović uopšte i nije glumac! On u svojim filmovima samo igra sebe, onakvog kakav on i jeste svom stvarnom životu. Jer, kako objasniti činjenicu da je u jednom-jedinom članku uspio da ispljuje i Srbe sa Pala i muslimane iz Sarajeva. Malo je ljigavo da čovjek o sebi sam kaže da je kao glumac "dvije stepenice iznad svih"!

Ova flaša od čovjeka isto misli i o Beograđanima! Ni tamo mu niko ne valja, od političara pa do običnih ljudi. Naravno, izuzetak čini njegov tast kod koga bi otišao čak i da ovaj živi u Prištini.

Za ovog kvazi-glumca čak ni Kusturica ne valja! Možda je to zbog toga što je Kusta bar dvije stepenice iznad njega. I kao čovjek i kao umjetnik!

Što se ovog jadnika tiče, želja mi je da se njegovo ime nikada ne pomene na ovoj stranici. A što se njegovih filmova tiče, vjerovatno ću da ih u budućnosti izbjegavam.
prepiska - 72798 - 15.08.2012 : Vogošćanin Pravi Vogošća - best (3)

Kako sam pucao na Sarajevo


Dobro sam osjetio na svojoj koži predratnu demokratiju muslimana u Sarajevu. Ta muka me je opredjelila da se borim za svoj narod u ratu, jer sam vidio da budučnost srpskom narodu neće biti dobra u "demokratskoj" Bosni.

Mogu da ti kažem da ni dan-danas ne mrzim muslimane kao ljude, ali politiku koju su provodili me je natjerala da kroz moje tekstove pišem o muslimanskom stanovništvu u BiH. Vjeruj mi da nemam ništa protiv da muslimani prave svoju državu na tom prostoru, čak sam i ja kao i mnogi Srbi za tu stvar. Ja samo želim da moj narod ne bude u takvoj državi!

Ne vjerujem u istinitost teksta "Kako sam pucao na Sarajevo", jer su mnogo manje poznati likovi vrlo lako mogli da budu angažovani na nekim funkcijama gdje se nije moralo pucati po liniji, tako je da profesor Bora Stepanović na osnovu svojih sposobnosti mogao izbjeći da bude u rovu. Ali, ako je Bora Stepanović ovo izjavio onda je on za mene isti kao Jovan Divijak koji je žestoko pucao i ubijao srpsku djeci na cijeloj teritoriji BiH. Takođe, ako je Bora Stepanović bio vojno angažovan, a ne vjerujem da je bio prisiljen da puca, jer u toku rata nisam primjetio da je neko kontrolisao da li se i ko puca prema gradu.

Kod mene u Vogošći je bio jedan Dragan, dobar nišandžija na artiljeriskim oruđima. Kada je bio pozvan na početku rata da ide na artiljeriju, odbio je taj poziv i javno govorio da ne želi to da radi i govorio je, citiram "ne želim da pucam po mojoj braći muslimanima". Ništa mu se nije desilo zbog toga, a nije bio prisiljavan da ide na artiljeriju. Samo papci su pucali bez cilja po gradu, mi borci ih nismo volili zbog toga. Pucali su da bi se dokazali kao da su oni veći "heroji" od ostalih. Takvi "heroji" pucali su po gradu da se dokažu i to su na sebi svojstven način pokazivali, da su oni neke veće "face". Možda je i Bora jedan od tih faca?

Moji saborci i ja smo bili žestoki protivnici da se bez plana i cilja gađa po Sarajevu, i ne samo po gradu već i po linijama razdvajanja. Muslimanski mediji su svojim lažnim izvještavanjima stvarali veliko ogorčenje kod Srba, pa je to doprinosilo dodatnom granatiranju Sarajeva.

Na mnogo lokacija u gradu, muslimani su postavljali oruđa i oružja koja su bila legitiman cilj pa se zbog toga još žešće granatiralo gradsko jezgro. Činjenica je da muslimani svoje zločine opravdavaju. U toku rata u i oko Sarajeva, Srbi su pokušavali da zaštite teritorije koje je pretežno naseljavalo srpsko stanovništvo, dok su muslimani te teitorije neprekidno napadali da ih oslobode od nas, legalnih vlasnika te zemlje! To je za vas muslimane opravdano i zbog toga ne treba da nam šalješ poruku od Bore Stepanovića, nego ti pročitaj šta vam kaže najpoznatiji sarajevski lik, Emir Kusturica! Tako treba da počnete razmišljati, da bi konačno bili ono što stvarno i jeste!

Iskreno da ti kažem, veoma sam razočaran kako muslimansko stanovništvo shvata rat u Bosni. Sebe prikazuju kao nevinu jagnjad za klanje a Srbe kao svoje kasapine.

E ne može više tako!!!

Od čijih granata su ginula naša djeca, žene i straci? Čije granate su padale po našim ulicama i razarale naše gradove. Da to možda nisu bili njihovi gradovi koje smo mi okupirali? Zašto je za njih dobar Srbin, samo onaj koji se povinuje njihovim zahtjevima i pravilima? Gdje danas Miro Lazović, glavni Srbin u multietničkom ratnom Sarajevu?

Stari Blizo, razmisli malo o tome!!!
prepiska - 72788 - 15.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (1)

O vojvodama i knezovima


Nije mi poznat lik i delo Vojvode Joje, a "potamo se jado" je crnogorska uzrečica a njome komentarišem da je ratne veterane bolje zaobići nego začikavati. Jer čikalo mora da zna da može "ostati na mestu" ne čačka se kratak fitilj...

Što se tiče "vojvoda i knezova", nisam u grupi njihovih poklonika. A Vojvode rukopoložene od Vojislava Šešelja, trebalo bi da znaju da nije bio validan za to, da ga je Momčilo Đujić ražalovao i optužio za izdaju, tu nema sumnje lično sam odavno gledao VHS snimak Đujićevog obraćanja i obrazloženja javnosti. Inače sam unuk Ravnogorca, i drugog dede nemačkog zarobljenika i kraćeg robijaša komunizma...

Ali kao dobrovoljca u Zapadnoj Slavoniji za dlaku me ne ubiše Šešeljevci u Voćinu! Za sat vremena boravka u njihovoj blizini jedna tuča, i pijani umalo da me upucaju.

U Istočnoj Bosni gadan belaj napraviše, a opet kažu da nisu oni nego je "Arkan", u istočnoj slavoniji nisu oni nego su "Beli orlovi", u Nevesinju opet nisu oni nego su optužili najbolju i najčasniju jedinicu Ćićolinu kojoj sam kasnije i ja pripadao i uvek ću biti ponosan na te časne ljude i časnog i poštenog Milenka Savića - Čovu!

Lažljivci nek znaju da ćemo svi na istinu, bez izuzetka. Da ne beše RATKA MLADIĆA, lokalne vojvode i knezovi bi ugrozili opstanak Republike Srpske!
prepiska - 72786 - 15.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (0)

Joja Tintor


gospodine Špiro, da ne pomislis da sam bilo šta pomislio loše na spram tebe. Govorim o tendencioznoj Srpskoj tj našoj "Srbijanskoj" spinovanoj štampi , koja jedva čeka da napadne sve nacionalno, patriotsko, versko...

Ovih dana, Joju i Peranovića kasape u štampi... A preko njih napadaju i Republiku Srpsku i Srpsku pravoslavnu crkvu. Ta orkestrirana štampa, a naša je nije to "Dnevni Avaz". Tako radi od dolaska vizionara na vlast oktobra...

Joja je to što je uradio, uradio kao Joja a ne kao vojvoda, ne kao Karadžićev čovek, ne kao neko ko je dao blindirani džip Karadžiću, bio povezan sa SDS-om... Kao što ni Patrijarh nije rekao Peranoviću udri sine dok ne slomiš lopatu...

U Srbiji sve što pripada nacionalnom korpusu, patriotama, naša štampa naziva "fasistima", huliganima, navijačkim grupama...

Svaki oblik kritike antisrpskog delovanja, naziva se najblaže netolerancijom, jer je vlastima "politička realnost" i zadatak i jedini uslov Brisela "rasrbljavanje i demontaža Srbije na svim nivoima" i vrlo su uspešni u tome... Ustvari, jedino su uspešni u tome...

I sjahali Murta, i novo uzjahali Kurta... Zadatak im je isti, gazda isti, sredstva za demontazu ista... Mediji osnovno i najvažnije sredstvo... Za ostvarenje cilja "Srbi u beogradskom pašaluku, bez resursa hrane i vode..."

Hoćemo li stić', pobjeć' tom njihovom cilju?!

Pozdrav!
jezik - 72785 - 15.08.2012 : Zeljko Tomic Sokolac - best (2)


Preuzeto iz Glas Javnosti
Srpski jezik i njegovi surogati

Vuk Karadžić je stvorio hrvatski jezik


Jedan od naših najznamenitijih stručnjaka iz oblasti jezičke nauke, Slobodan Remetić govori za Glas javnosti o srpskom jeziku i njegovim surogatima. Ključno Remetićevo gledište odnosi se na činjenicu da je na prostoru od Bugarske do Slovenije danas (ako poštujemo lingvističku logiku i jezičke činjenice) na sceni jedan književni jezik.

  • To je onaj tip književnog jezika koji je Vuk Stefanović Karadžić polovinom 19. veka reformisao za potrebe srpskog naroda i srpske kulture. Nauci je poznato kako je taj jezik postao književni jezik Hrvata. Zna se kako se taj jezik menjao, kako se iz društveno političkih potreba baš kod Hrvata nazivao hrvatski ili srpski, srpski, pa srpskohrvatski. Vremenom je imao i takozvane "svoje" varijante.

    Koje su najbitnije razlike kada su u pitanju ovi jezici?

  • Najbitnije razlike su bile u domenu leksike. Savršeno je jasno od hrvatskih jezikoslovaca (što je toliko puta posvedočeno u knjigama) da je Zagreb usvojio vukovski književni jezik. Tako se definitivno završio posao posle dužih rasprava 1879. godine odlukom državnog sabora. Zna se i to da je time kod hrvatskih katolika prevaziđena njihova diglosija i poliglosija, regionalna rascepkanost, da se taj zajednički jezik pokazao kao moćno, važno sredstvo, oružje u objedinjavanju svih katolika u Hrvatsku naciju. Išli su prema verskim stavovima, tako da su danas svi katolici u Hrvatskoj samo Hrvati. Danas su po istom principu u Bosni svi muslimani Bošnjaci. U Bošnjake hoće čak i muslimani iz Raške, koji Bosnu nikad možda nisu ni videli! Isto žele muslimani iz Crne Gore, pa čak i deo Goranaca.

    Kako tumačite tu pojavu?

  • To je mimo Evrope, mimo bilo kakvih pravila i zakona. To su oni problemi koji su bili aktuelni u doba Vuka i njegovih sledbenika koji su idući prema evropskoj standardizaciji govorili da je jezik osnovno nacionalno obeležje, jer će nam se svi smejati ako budemo po tom pitanju išli po veri. A kod nas je sve išlo po veri.

    U kojoj meri su Hrvati išli prema verskom načelu u jezičkoj standardizaciji?

  • Dok je bilo etike, naučni zvanični Zagreb nije krio motive posezanja za rešenjem pitanja jezika koje sam malopre pomenuo. I naš akademik Pavle Ivić je rekao da je to najjači politički potez koji je Zagreb ikada povukao. Naime, Hrvati su pisali (između ostalog i Brozović) da je to bio "natječaj u krajevima za koje se u to doba nije moglo predvideti hoće li se okupiti oko ove ili one nacionalne jezgre". U srednjem veku hrvatski nacionalni prostor karakteriše pokrajinska rascepkanost, regionalizam. Katolici su živeli u pet država. Pisali su na osam dijalekata. Ti dijalekti nisu imali ništa zajedničko. Kod većine štokavaca nije bilo nacionalne svesti.

    Često govorite da smo mi usvajanjem Vukovog tipa jezika od strane Hrvata ušli s njima "u pitonski zagrljaj"?

  • Zagreb je i pre usvajanja Vukovog tipa jezika bio pristao na štokavicu, ali, to je bio drugi tip štokavice - arhaički. Akcentuacija je takođe arhaičnija, ali, odlukom sabora preuzet je doslovce Vukov i Daničićev model književnog jezika sa svim elementima i akcentom. Po odluci sabora, pojedinci su dobili zaduženje da rade instrumente tog jezika, udžbenike, učila. Godine 1892. Ivan Broz izdaje i štampa "Hrvatski pravopis" gde on i sam kaže u predgovoru da bi se sve to moglo nazvati i srpskim pravopisom. On je sve preuzeo iz njihovih spisa. Da li slučajno, a kažu da ništa nije slučajno, imamo koincidenciju da je iste godine rođen i Josip Broz. Godine 1899. Tomo Maretič izdaje "Gramatiku i stilistiku hrvatskog ili srpskog jezika". On kaže "što je Ciceron za Latine, to je Vuk za nas!" Tako smo mi ušli u stogodišnji pitonski zagrljaj Hrvata, jer je Tuđman posle sto godina sve to završio.

    Načelno, ovaj potez nije odgovarao ni jednom ni drugom narodu.

  • Taj potez napadali su i Srbi i Hrvati. Srbi da je ukraden njihov jezik, a Hrvati su se borili što je zapostavljeno njihovo jezičko blago. Kako god hoćete, oni su završili svoj posao.

    Pokazalo se da je jezik moćno političko sredstvo.

  • Jezik jeste moćno političko sredstvo. Jezik je posao koji vode državni organi. Hteli mi to ili ne, danas istoriju ne možemo prekrajati. Istorija se malo poigrala rezultatima Vukovog rada. Kad je o jeziku reč, nismo se dobro proveli sa narodom drugačije prošlosti, drugačijih ambicija, drugačije religije. U taj brak nismo ušli sa istim osećanjima, planovima, istim stepenom poštenja i iskrenosti.

    Mi smo za razliku od naših suseda kako kažete ušli sa "raspolućenim jezikom". Srbi u Republici Srpskoj, u Bosni govore ijekavicu, Srbi u Crnoj Gori takođe.

  • Pogledajmo sa distance šta se zapravo desilo. Mi smo u ovaj milenijum ušli sa raspolućenim književnim jezikom, jezikom sa "manom", što kaže Pižurica. Dvoispisnost, dvoobraznost, jedno poređenje. Nemci su Goti, Vizigoti. Imali su gotiku kao veliko nacionalno pismo. Oni su veliki narod. Imali su Nemce sa svih strana. Čak bi i Jevreji bili germanizovani da nije bilo Hitlera. Mi pravimo razlike na semantičkim odlikama. Ekavski i jekavski nema nikakvu sadržinu. Imamo dva bukvara. Nevolja je velika što je Vuk bio ijekavac. Bilo mu je to bliže. Na ijekavici je skupljao i narodne umotvorine. Vuk je uvrstio u ovo blago i ono koje je uzeo od "braće muhamedanskog zakona", od "braće drugog zakona". Jezik je bio harmoniziran, ali, danas je ekavsko-ijekavsko dvojstvo specifičnost samo srpskog jezika. Kod Hrvata nemate ni deset odsto tih razlika. Kad imate katolika koji govori novoštokavski jekavski to je nešto sekularno.

    Šta se to zapravo dogodilo? Ko je od koga šta "uzeo"?

  • Ili su katolici Hrvati od suseda Srba preuzeli njihov dijalekat ili su Srbi promenili njihov dijalekat, ili su, pak, Srbi promenili veru. Poseban slučaj je Dubrovnik. Do rata u Dubrovniku nije bilo nikakve nacionalne svesti. Oni su na sve gledali sa distance, odozgo. Kad je Dubrovnik slaviziran (bio je dugo romanski) ostalo je hercegovačko zaleđe. Tamo je zastupljen hercegovački dijalekt. Srpska Akademija nauka i umetnosti je objavila "Rečnik Dubrovačkoga govora". U srednjem veku dileme nema. Danas su Dubrovčani Hrvati, ali, u srednjem veku kod Srba je bila veoma izražena nacionalna svest. Postojao je snažan kosovski mit, svetosavska crkva, epika. Ipak, ako bi Srbin iz Gacka ili Nevesinja otišao da živi u Dubrovnik, on bi postajao Dubrovčanin. Postoje dokumenta u kojima je stajalo da se 95 odsto u Dubrovniku govorilo "lingua Serbiana", a samo 5 odsto hrvatskim jezikom.

    Savremeni hrvatski jezički stručnjaci smatraju da nema Vukovih zasluga u "tvorbi" Hrvatskog književnog jezika.

  • Danas Hrvati pišu da su do književnog jezika došli nevezano od Vuka. Čak i da je Vuk od njih preuzeo neka rešenja! Setimo se Marčetića koji je Vuka nazvao Ciceronom! Vuk je, to mnogi Srbi gube iz vida, značajno evoluirao u svom poslu tako da su Vuk početnik i Vuk iz završetka svog posla, sa kraja poznih spisa - dva antipoda, dve stvarnosti potpuno različite! To ljudi ne znaju. Vuk je odustao od većine svojih deklarativnih opredeljenja. On to nije priznavao, ali je u praksi drugačije radio.

    Imate li neke konkretne primere za to?

  • Evo nekoliko primera: On je od načela da svako piše kao što govori (što bi vodilo stravičnoj rascepkanosti neograničenih razmera) stigao do "opće nepravilnosti svega" - da se broji najpravilniji oblik. Rekao je i da "pisci kvare jezik" u početku, a posle je ukazivao na njihovu odgovornost, na njihove kreativne obaveze u formiranju jezika i komunikaciji. On je govorio da se "u gradovima govori najgore". Kada je počeo da piše ekavsku varijantu, primetno je bilo da je to moderna ekavica. Kad su ga pitali zašto, rekao je da se staroj varijanti rugaju u Beogradu i Kragujevcu. Starija je "djevojka" od "đevojke". Čuo je "h" kod Dubrovčana i uveo ga u naš jezik. Književni jezik je stvar konvencije. Svaki književni jezik je pomalo strani jezik i mora se učiti. Nigde književni jezik nije narodni. Nije ni maternji.
  • treskavica - 72780 - 15.08.2012 : Burke Sanski Most - best (2)

    Garda, Đokin toranj


    Od kraja oktobra 1994. godine položaj na Pašinoj planini je držala 1. četa 1. bataljona 1. gmbr. Đokin toranj je oko 1000 metara ispred Pašine planine, između našeg položaja i položaja Armija muslimanske BiH koji se nalazio na Zubovima.

    Zbog bolje preglednosti i boljih zaklona našeg položaja na Pašinoj planini u odnosu na položaj Armija muslimanske BiH, svakodnevno smo izlazili na Đokin toranj i zadržavali se po nekoliko sati, ako bi vremenski uslovi dozvoljavali, i više. Obično su tri do četri vojnika odlazila na toranj dok su ostali ostajali na Pašinoj planini da bi mogli da nas zaštite u slučaju da su i pripadnici Armija muslimanske BiH krenuli ili već stigli na toranj a da mi to nismo primjetili na vrijeme, što se jednom i dogodilo sredinom februara 1995. godine, kada su se nakon petnestak minuta puskaranja i povukli. Tom prilikom kod nas nije bilo ni ranjenih ni poginulih, a za njih ne znam.

    Prvi stalni položaj naše vojske desno od našeg položaja na Pašinoj planini nalazio se tek na Lupocu, znači nekih 5-6 kilometara, a isto tako je bilo i sa naše lijeve strane.

    Od oktobra 1994. godine smo boravili u dvije zemunice koje su se nalazile ispod Pašine planine, po petnest vojnika u svakoj. Dva dana na položaju pa onda četri odmora u Gvoznom polju, i sve tako do sredine januara 1995. godine, kada su zemunice zatrpane sa preko pet metara snijega. Nakon toga smo mjesec dana vršili svakodnevne patrole iz Gvoznog polja do Pašine planine. Polazili bismo u četri sata ujutro, gore bismo stizali oko osam, a nekad i kasnije ako bi vrijeme bilo loše ili ako bi napadao novi snijeg. Povratak je bio oko četri sata popodne. Jedan dan smo išli u smjenu, a zatim smo imali tri dana odmora, mada sam ja zbog kazne od komandira čete išao svaki dan, dvadeset dana za redom.

    Sredinom februara 1995. godine, transportni helikopter donosi materijal za dvije nove barake. Jedna je napravljena na mjestu gdje su zatrpane zemunice, a druga ispod samog vrha Pašine planine, tako da smo opet uspostavili stalni boravak na položaju. Tako je sve trajalo do 15. aprila 1995. godine kada smo napadnuti. U tom napadu poginulo je petnest naših vojnika, a nekoliko je ranjeno.
    australija - 72776 - 15.08.2012 : Mladen Dokman Banja Luka - best (1)

    Molim savjet


    Poštovani,

    Moje ime je Mladen i imam 34 godine po zanimanju pogonski elektrotehničar, radnog iskustva 15 godina od toga desetak u radnoj knjižici (sve u struci, održavanje mašina, elektro-instalacije na kućama i zgradama, proizvodnja razvodnih i upravljačkih ormara itd.)

    Oženjen sam i imamo sinčić 2,5 godine.


    Supruga je Diplpmirani inženjer tehnologije smjer kontrola ispravnosti namjernica. Ima položen strucni ispit i radnog iskustva oko godinu i 6 mjeseci.

    IELTS planiramo polagati, ne znam samo da li je za nju dovoljan general ili mora polagati academic?

    Pošto supruga ima rođenu sestru u Sidneju, a moja struka je na spisku SOL-a imamo dilemu oko toga ko bi bio bolji nosilac vize pa stoga molimo za savjet, mišljenje.

    P. S. Sidnej nije presudan voljni smo ići bilo gdje.

    Hvala unapred i veliki pozdrav od Mladena, Jelene i Nikole

    Mladene,

    i ja mislim da je bolje da ti budeš nosilac liste, i zbog struke a i zbog radnog iskustva. Pod uslovom da su ti je znanje engleskog relativno dobro, tj. da dobiješ 7.5, šanse su vam relativno dobre.

    E sada jedan savjet! Veoma je važno u kojem dijelu godine konkurišeš za Australiju. Ne znam kada tačno, ali mislim da pred kraj godine australijska ambasada ispuni kvotu za primanje, pa onda prima procentualno mnogo manje osoba. Zbog toga je ponekad bolje konkurisati u prvoj polovini godine. Opet kažem da ne znam tačno kada dobijaju kvotu za narednu godinu. Tu informaciju moraš da sam provjeriš.
    prepiska - 72772 - 15.08.2012 : Spiro Novi Banovci - best (0)

    Vojvoda Joja


    Gospodine Novace, nije mi jasno zasto se obracate samo meni po pitanju Jovana Tintora-Joje, ja sam samo prenio agencijsku vijest, a nisam bio sam i ne znam zasto je Joja "jadni" vjerovatno da jeste, ali po drugim pitanjima. Ako se malo zainteresujete i želite saznati mišljenje njegovih bivših komšija Vogošćana, prije svega mislim na Srbe, onda ćete doći do zaključka da je stvarno "jadan" ali ne zbog ovog ubistva kojeg je počinio, nego zbog mnogo toga, a prije svega zbog njegovog ponasanja kao "vojvode" u toku proteklog rata. Ja imam posebno razloga da ga smatram jadnim jer sam kao otac poginulog borca VRS na svojoj koži osjetio šta znači vjerovati "velikim" Srbima, a i Joju sigurno bolje poznajem od vas jer smo se družili prije rata dok je držao kafanu "Čikin vir" u Semizovcu.
    australija - 72770 - 14.08.2012 : Nebojsa Beograd - best (1)

    Posao u Australiji


    Postovani Željko,

    Hvala na svoj pomoći koju nam pružate. Imao bih jedno pitanje koje verujem zanima mnoge ljude odavde. Zanima me kakva je procedura i koliko je tesko, ako se ode u Australiju na turističku vizu, da se u slučaju zaposlenja tamo (na neko ne stručno mesto kao noćni čuvar i sl. ) ta viza "zameni" i produži radnom vizom? Da li je potreban test engleskog ili kakva god druga procedura.

    Unapred zahvalan.

    Po australijskom zakonu možeš da apliciraš za "permanent resident" čak i ukoliko se već nalaziš u Australiji. Međutim, kriterijumi za dobijanje vize su gotovo identični kao i iz Srbije - sa izuzetkom što je skuplje ali imaš i veće šanse.
    srebrenica_man - 72768 - 14.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (0)


    Ethnic Conflicts in Civil War in Bosnia -Political manipulation with term of Genocide (6)

    LIST OF THE CAMPS FOR SERBS IN SREBRENICA: (320. SREBRENICA, a prison between the buildings of the Municipality Court and the City Hall 321. SREBRENICA, prison of a police station 322. SREBRENICA, village of Potocari, private prison of Oric Naser 323. SREBRENICA, village of Sceska, Zulfo Tursunovic's private prison Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Zeravice and the village of Recice, the municipality of Han Pijesak, August 1993. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: On August 2, 1993, soldiers of Muslim armed formations attacked the Serb villages of Recice and Zeravice. In Recice, there were no victims in the civilian population because the villagers had fled before the soldiers' arrival. The soldiers looted and then burnt seven houses with auxiliary buildings. The burnt houses were owned by Dusan and Milovan Golijan, Tomo and Vasa Golijan, Stevan Golijan and his brothers, Rajko Vaskovic, Svetozar Golijan and Milorad Golijan. Muslim soldiers attacked Zeravice the same day and killed: 1. Dobrivoje Golijan, born on April 6, 1926, resident of Zeravice, 2. Rajka Todorovic, born in 1958, who had been mentally ill, 3. Aleksa Golijan, born in 1923, 4. Danica Sokanovic, born in 1926, 5. Milovan Golijan, born in 1967, 6. Marko Mirovic, born in 1923, 7. Jovan Sokanovic, born in 1931, 8. Zora Sokanovic, born in 1936, wife of Jovan Sokanovic. During the attack, Dana Sokanovic, a primary school pupil, sustained a wound in the arm, after which she was captured and taken by Muslim soldiers to Kladanj, together with Golijan Velimir, born in 1946 and Milojka Mirovic, born in 1926. When they occupied the village, the Muslim soldiers plundered and burnt down more than 70 Serb-owned houses and their auxiliary buildings and took away some 200 heads of cattle. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Brajko Huseinovic, of father Hamid, m. Ajsa - maiden name Doljancic, born on October 7, 1959 in Rubnici, the municipality of Han Pijesak, tradesman by profession, employed in TP "Napredak" before the war, permanent residence in Rubinici, the municipality of Han Pijesak, 2. Rifet Vrabac, called "Bekan", of father Djulbeg, m. Sema - maiden name Bubic, born on December 1, 1961, in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, timber dispatcher by profession, employed in SIP "Planinsko", Han Pijesak, before the war, permanent residence in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, 3. Rizvo Vrabac, of father Sahbaz, born on November 10, 1953, in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, driver by profession, employed in SIP "Planinsko", Han Pijesak, permanent residence in Nevacka, 4. Becir Makanic, of father Jakub, m. Cura, born on April 15, 1957, machine technician by profession, permanent residence in Vlasenica, commander of 1st Muslim detachment of Cer, 5. Ismet Vrabac, called "Redzo", of father Djulbeg, m. Sema - maiden name Bubic, born on September 1, 1963 in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, worker by profession, employed in SIP "Planinsko", Han Pijesak, before the war, permanent residence in Nevacka, 6. Muhamed Vrabac, of father Mujo, born on February 10, 1939, in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, employed in PTT, Han Pijesak, before the war, permanent residence in Nevacka, 7. Resid Imanovic, of father Bajra, born on July 13, 1955 in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, locksmith by profession, employed in SIP "Planinsko", Han Pijesak, before the war, permanent residence in Nevacka, reserve JNA officer before the war, 8. Zaim Avdagic, of father Himzo, born on May 28, 1946, in Turalici, the municipality of Vlasenica, carpenter by profession, employed in SIP "Planinsko", Han Pijesak, before the war, permanent residence in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, 9. Zijad Avdagic, of father Himzo, born in 1962 in Turalici, the municipality of Vlasenica, worker by profession, employed in DP "Stupcanica", Olovo, permanent residence in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, 10. Galib Durakovic, of father Osman, m. Mevla - maiden name Sanderovic, born on August 12, 1945 in Sasevci, the municipality of Olovo, coachman by profession, employed in SIP "Planinsko", Han Pijesak, before the war, permanent residence in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, 11. Hajrudin Glasic, of father Began, born on January 5, 1953 in Rubinici, the municipality of Han Pijesak, worker by profession, employed in SIP "Planinsko", Han Pijesak, before the war, permanent residence in Rubinici, 12. Semso Harderbasic, of father Hamid, born on January 24, 1939 in Nevacka, worker by profession, employed in DP "Stupcanica", Olovo, before the war, permanent residence in Nevacka, the municipality of Han Pijesak, 13. Ramiz Camdzic, born in 1938 in Podglavica, the municipality of Kladanj, butcher by profession, permanent residence in Podglavica, the municipality of Kladanj, 14. Alija Mutapcic, born in 1957, in Vlasenica, worker by profession,permanent residence in Vlasenica, the "Bacino Brdo" settlement. EVIDENCE: Records on investigation on the spot, with photo- documentation, medical findings, testimonies by witnesses filed with the Committee under No. 136/95-2. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Potocani, end of May and beginning of June, 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: At the end of May, 1992, most probably on 25 or 26 May, in the village of Potocani, Muslim soldiers in "Green Beret" uniforms, under command of Semin Rustanpasic, killed the following Serbs: 1. Draga Cavic, of father Nedeljko, born in 1933, 2. Milenko Lukic. At the beginning of June, the following persons were also killed in this village: 3. Ljubo Cavic, of father Ljubo, born in 1911, and his wife, 4. Bosa Cavic, of father Aleksa, born in 1924 - slaughtered in front of their house. A big cross was cut into Ljuba's chest. Bosa's throat was cut, both her breasts were cut off, her eyes were gouged out and her ears cut off. Both her arms were cut to the elbows. 5. Jelena Jovic, of father Milan, born in 1928. Her nose, ears and arms were cut off and her eyes were gouged. 6. Mara, from Kupres by birth, was slaughtered. 7. Radojka Prgomelja, of father Stanoje, born in 1944. Her right leg and nose were cut off, her eyes were gouged out and she was cut all over the body. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Semin Rustanpasic, commander of the "Green Berets" unit, 2. Senad Bajric, 3-6. Eric, Corina, Rizvan and Durakovic, "Green Berets" soldiers. EVIDENCE: Testimony by the witness 234/95-13. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. On October 5, 1992, Moslem armed formations attacked the house of Sreten Djokic in the village of Divovici near Bratunac, and two days later the bodies of the people killed in Divovici were handed over to the Serbs. The body of Sreten Djokic was given without the head and the right arm. On the neck hung a patch of skin with hair from the top of his head. The head and the arm have not been found and the body was buried accordingly. Proof: 37/94-6. In an attack on the Serb village of Brezani, the commune of Srebrenica, on June 30, 1992, members of Moslem armed forces killed 19 serb villagers. The body of Milos Novakovic from the hamlet of Cicevac was found with the head cut off. Proof: 493/94-9, 493/94-5, 493/94-6, 493/94-7, 493/94-8 and 635/94-9. Slavko Mladjenovic, (father Ljubomir), born in 1965, was killed on August 8, 1992 during an attack on the village of Jezestice, the commune of Bratunac. He was buried without the head which had been cut off and taken away. Proof: 68/94 and 635/94-28. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. In clashes between Moslem armed forces and those of the Army of the Republic of Srpska on November 5,1992 in the area of Kamenica, the commune of Zvornik, the Moslems captured and killed by beheading Vlado Grabovica, Savo Djokic, Dragomir Bozic, Slavko Tijanic, Savo Kazanovic and Radomir Pavlovic. Dragomir Bozic was massacred his head severed from the body. The head of Slavko Tijanic was found without the eyes, ears and nose, a 6 mm diameter iron bar was found in his chest, while his neck, hands and feet were tied with wire. The head of Savo Kazanovic had also been cut off, his chest pierced with a large nail, and he himself nailed to an oak tree and crucified. A head without the body was also found which is assumed to have belonged to Milos Grabovica. The following were also killed in Kamenica on November 5,1992: Miladin Asceric, 28; Mico Tesic, 24, and Nikola Milinovic, 27. They were also beheaded. Proof: 184/94-5, 184/95-6, 184/95-7 and 184/95-8. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. In an attack carried out on June 3,1992 on the village of Brezane, the commune of Srebrenica, Moslems killed Milivoje Mitrovic and Stanoje Mitrovic. When this village was liberated in April 1993 their headless bodies were found. Stanoje Mitrovic's throat had been slit by one "Kemo" from Pale. Proof: 635/94-9. The Moslems killed the Serb Sredoje Jovanovic from Krnice by beheading him when they attacked this village on July 5, 1992. Proof: 493/94-13. On September 24,1992 Moslem forces occupied the village of Podravanje in the commune of Milici, set it to fire, looted it and killed all the wounded they came across in the village. They killed 19 persons on that occasion and massacred their bodies. Zulfo Tursumovic from Suceska had the severely wounded Tomislav Perendic put his head in his (Tursumovic's) lap and then slaughtered him and cut his head off. Svetozar Jovanovic's head was cut off and impaled on a stake and Gojko Tomic was beheaded and his head thrown some 20 metres away from the body. Proof: 184/95-34. 33. REPORT OF THE SECRETARY-GENERAL PURSUANT TO SECURITY COUNCIL RESOLUTION 1019 (1995) ON VIOLATIONS OF INTERNATIONAL HUMANITARIAN LAW IN THE AREAS OF SREBRENICA, ZEPA, BANJA LUKA AND SANSKI MOST UNITED NATIONS Security Council Distr. GENERAL S/1995/988 27 November 1995 ORIGINAL: ENGLISH 95-37227 (E) 281195/... *9537227* A. Missing persons 4. The Bosnian Serb offensive on Srebrenica from 6 to 11 July 1995 led to a mass displacement of the entire Bosnian Muslim community of the area. An estimated 25,000 people were forcibly evacuated on a convoy of buses and trucks organized by the Bosnian Serb authorities. A group of people, estimated at between 10,000 and 15,000, most of whom were men, left Srebrenica on foot. The exact number of persons from these two groups who arrived safely in Bosnian Government-held territory is not known. By most accounts, the local population prior to the Bosnian Serb offensive numbered 38,000 to 40,000, although UNHCR estimated the population of the enclave for food distribution purposes at 42,600. 5. Thousands of people still remain unaccounted for. An unknown number who made their way to safety have simply not been registered by the appropriate authorities. At least several hundred persons are believed to have been killed in armed combat. There are also accounts of men in hiding in Bosnian Serb-held territory, although no more than a few hundred men are believed to be still at large. 6. It is thus difficult to ascertain the exact numbers of those missing. The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) has received over 10,000 tracing requests from families and has determined that 2,000 of the requests are duplicative, leaving a total of 8,000 tracing requests. A further analysis by ICRC indicates that 5,000 of the tracing requests concern individuals who are said to have left the enclave before it was taken by Bosnian Serb forces. Some 3,000 requests concern persons who were taken from their families by Bosnian Serb forces during the expulsion itself. 34.Faxsimil of document of Bosnian Muslim Army (BMA) 1.Republic of Bosnia and Herzegovina ARMY OF R. BiH Defense of Republic The 285.East Bosnian Brigade Zepa Top secret No.08-20-454/95 Date: 19.04.1995. State security Defense of Republic military secret - Top confidential HEADQUARTER OF ARMY DIRECTION FOR TACTICAL HEAD OF DEPARTMENT Asim Dzambasovic Connection with your act, top secret No: 2/628 from 18.04.1995 Requested information we submitting to you: We are submitting you data of military equipment, which arrived;
    ARTICLEZEPASREBRENICAIN TOTOAL
    Bullets cal 7,6223.50050.00073.500
    Mines 82mm153550
    Mines 60mm2575100
    Rockets TF-8404
    B.R. M-933490124
    Lancer TF-8101
    Office materials25171
    Comandant: Avdo Palic COMMENT: It is evidently that Srebrenica, which was Demilitarization Zone under the protection of UN, was supplied by weapons and military equipment. 2. The Republic of Srpska - Civilian Affairs Committee for Srebrenica No:07-27/95 Date: July 17 1995 DECLARATION of the Representatives of the Civilian Authorities of the Enclave of Srebrenica on the realization of the agreement on the evacuation of the civilian population of the Enclave. A meeting was held on July 12 1995 in the "Hotel Fontana", on our request, between representatives of our civilian Authorities and representatives of the civilian Authorities and the Army of the Republic of Srpska, concerning the evacuation of our civilian population out of the enclave. Our side was represented by: Purkovic Camila, Nuhanovic Ibro and me, Nasib Mandzic. The Serb side was represented by: Civil Affairs Commissioner for Srebrenica, Deronjic Miroslav, General Ratko Mladic, the President of the country of Bratunac Ljubisav Simic, the Chief Executive of the country of Bratunac Srbislav Davidovic, the Chief of Police Zvornik, Mr. Vasic, General Kristic, Corp Security Chief Mr. Popovic and Colonel Krstic. The negotations were attended by UNPROFOR Representative, Dutch Battalion Commander. The following was agreed: -The civilian population can remain in the enclave or evacuated, depend upon the wish of each individual; -In the event that we wish to evacuate it is possible for us to chose the direction of our movement and have decided that the entire population is to evacuate to the territory of Country of Kladanj; -It has been agreed that the evacuation is to be carried out by the Army and Police of the Republic of Srpska, supervised and escorted by UNPROFOR. After the Agreement had been reached, I assent that the evacuation on was carried out by the Serb side correctly and the clauses of the agreement had been adhered to. During the evacuation there were no incidents on either of the sides and the Serb side has adhered to all the regulations of Geneva Conventions and the international war law, as far as concern convoy escorted by UN forces. UN representative Representative of the Civilian (signature) Authorities of the Enclave of Srebrenica Colonel Karemans Mandzic Nesib Civil Affaire Commisioner for Srebrenica Miroslav Deronjic
    srebrenica_man - 72766 - 14.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (0)


    Ethnic Conflicts in Civil War in Bosnia - Political manipulation with term of Genocide (5)

    DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Jelasci, the commune of Visegrad, 1 August 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: In the night of 2 August Moslem military troops attacked the village of Jelasci and shot the following civilians: 1. Milo Savic, born in 1943, of father Gvozden, 2. Petka Savic, born in 1945 of father Dragomir, 3. Radomir Savic, born in 1949, of father Gvozden, 4. Dragan Susnjar, born in 1928, of father Jovan, 5. Slavka Susnjar, born in 1930, 6. Trivun Jelicic, born in 1929, of father Velizar, 7. Sava Jelicic, born in 1920, 8. Mirjana Jelicic, born 1960, of father Miloje, 9. Dragana Jelicic, 8 years old, 10. Vidoje Jelicic, 11 years old. The victims were killed in their homes or leaving their houses. Each of them had several bullet shots on their bodies. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Ahmed Sejdic, from Visegrad, commander of a Moslem military unit. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witnesses filed with the Committee under numbers 440/94-36 and 440/94-40. NOTE: Supplement to application I-139. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Vlahovici, the commune of Visegrad, 9 June 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: A group of Moslem soldiers killed the following civilians from the village of Vlahovici on 9 June in a field called Krcevina: 1. Dragomir Simsic, born in 1949, of father Momcilo, 2. Perka Simsic, maiden name Gogic, born in 1941, of father Vitomir, and 3. Bozo Simsic, born in 1932, of father Obren. Dragomir and Perka Simsic were killed by Bajic and Sabanovic from fire arms, and Bozo Simsic was both shot and slaughtered by Hurem. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Hamdo Bajic, from Velika Gostilja, the commune of Visegrad, of father Asim and mother Mejrema, 2. Adil Sabanovic, from Mala Gostilja, the commune of Visegrad, born on 27 November 1972 in Visegrad, of father Rifet, 3. Ragib Hurem, called Rapce, from Mala Gostilja, the commune of Visegrad, born on 24 September 1960, of father Ragib and mother Hajra. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness and an application of the public security station in Visegrad, Ku. 6/93, filed with the Committee under number 440/94-35. NOTE: Supplement to application I-139. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Donja Lijeska, near Visegrad, 25 October 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: The witness Pecikoza was nearby the house of Milka Zecevic when Moslem soldiers who attacked that Serbian village took the fifty year old Milka out of her house and killed her. The witness was about fifty meters away from them. He recognized Maric, Alija Kustura and Zain Kustura. After the murder they burnt her house, as well as the houses of other Serbs from the village. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Osman Maric, from the village of Babica Potok near Visegrad, 2. Alija Kustura, from the village of Okruglo, near Visegrad, 3. Zain Kustura, from the village of Okruglo, near Visegrad. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness filed with the Committee under number 440/94-29 DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Mesici, the commune of Rogatica, 26 June 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: On 26 June 1992, Moslem soldiers attacked the Serbian village of Mesici near Rogatica and in the settlement Hidroelektrana they killed Nedjo Gladanac from Mesici, born on 25 August 1922 in Sudici, of father Ostoja. On his body there were several bullet wounds and several knife stabs in the chest and the neck. The next day when the family was burying Gladanac Moslem soldiers came and disturbed the funeral. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Members of the Moslem Army. 2. Minutes from the hearing of the witnesses filed with the Committee under number 440/94-21. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The villages of Klisura and Bursici, the commune of Visegrad, 8 August 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: On 8 August 1992 a Moslem military unit attacked the Serbian villages of Klisura and Bursici near Visegrad, in which there were no Serb troops. In front of the house of Marko Kusmuk Moslem soldiers killed his two sons while he was tending sheep nearby: 1. Milorad Kusmuk, born in 1961 and 2. Milos Kusmuk, born in 1965, and burnt the house in which were: 3. Danica Kusmuk, Marko's wife, born in 1931, of father Dusan and 4. Joka Vukasinovic, Marko's aunt, born in 1914 of father Milos. Danica burnt in the house, and Joka managed to escape the fire, but was shortly afterwards killed by Moslem soldiers. The following persons were also killed: 5. Drago Kusmuk, born in 1954, of father Veso and 6. Zoran Kojic, from the neighbouring village of Adrovici, born in 1965, of father Ljubo. On the same day the following persons were killed in the village of Bursici by Moslem soldiers: 7. Bozana Ircagic, born in 1905, and her daughter 8. Stanojka Ircagic, born in 1933, of father Vojin. After that they burnt Kusmuk's house, two stables, a pigsty, a shed, a cottage and a dairy, and left out 105 sheep and 13 cows, altogether to the value of 700,000 DM. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Dzevad Sisic, born in 1961, in the village of Bogdasici, near Visegrad, of father Ismet, 2. Dzevad Muharemovic, from Medjedja near Visegrad, born in 1961, of father called "Pobro". EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness filed with the Committee under number 440/94-20. NOTE: Supplement to application I-116. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Donja Lijeska near Visegrad, late July 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: In late July 1992, a group of Moslem soldiers headed by Ramiz Nuhanovic, entered the house of Radojka Rajak, born in 1927, of father Milic Bozovic; Nuhanovic killed Radojka from firearms on the threshold of her house. Radojka had several bullet wounds on her body. After the murder, they burnt the house and all auxiliary facilities (a stable for cows, a pigsty, a barn), altogether to the value of 500,000 DM. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Ramiz Nuhanovic, from the village of Tustamedj near Visegrad. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness filed with the Committee under number 440/94-30. NOTE: Supplement to application I-139. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of arrested persons-POWs. PLACE AND TIME: Srebrenica, September-October 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: After the arrest, Tursumovic cut the witness's chest with a knife, which left a visible scar. After that he was taken to the Srebrenica police for hearing. There they put a pistol into his mouth and Koljevic pulled the trigger, but the bullet was not in the barrel, and only a clicking sound could be heard. Then everybody started beating him, after which they called Dragoljub Kukic for hearing; they hit him against the ground and beat him. Kukic reacted at one point by cursing their Ustashi mother, after which Ahmetovic took a log which was by the stove, and hit Kukic in the chest with it until he died. They threw Kukic's body on a junk yard somewhere near Podravanj. The witness was later beaten with the same log, and Ahmetovic knocked his tooth out. When he was beaten on other occasions they knocked out all his teeth and broke his ribs in 14 places. They put out cigarettes on his legs, which left scars. They urinated into his mouth. They hanged him on the ceiling by tying his legs with a rope hung on a wheel fixed to a strip. As a result of such an inhumane treatment and poor diet, the witness lost 30 kg in 21 days in the prison, and had 62 kg when he left the prison. Naser Oric also participated in the beating of prisoners. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Zulfo Tursumovic, 2. Mirzet Koljevic, head of the police, 3. Kemal Ahmetovic, called "Kemo", 4. "Beli", a guard, 5. Naser Oric, commander of the Moslem army in Srebrenica. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness filed with the Committee under number 378/94-14. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of arrested persons-POWs. PLACE AND TIME: Gornji Potocari, the commune of Bratunac, June 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: Dragan Mitrovic, a retired miner, born in 1929, from the village of Donji Magasic, was heavily disabled and walked with two walking sticks. On 16 June he tended cattle nearby his house when he was approached by Babajic, Ramic and Ibrahimovic from the village of Glogovo and forcibly taken to the Moslem village of Cizmici and closed in the house of Camil Muratovic. He was beaten. On 25 June Mitrovic's sons were on the hill called "Cuka", in the neighborhood of Cizmici, when they heard Moslems calling them, proposing to negotiate on the exchange of Mitrovic. They wanted to see their father first, and they took him out in front of Camil Muratovic's stable. Mitrovic could hardly walk with the help of a stick; he shouted that he was alive and well. In exchange for Mitrovic they demanded 5 tons of flour or 5 boxes of ammunition, which his sons did not have. Then they shouted to them: "Send your mother Jovanka. We have no one to fuck; we'll give you your father back". Mitrovic's sons felt humiliated and asked in despair their friends to kill their father so that Moslems could not torture and humiliate him any more, but they refused. Mitrovic was taken to the prison in Gornji Potocar, where Beslic, the warden, beat him daily; one day he hit his head against the wall, and when he fell kicked him to death with his boots. His body was thrown into the Potocanska reka (a river), and later taken in a truck in an unknown direction. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Hajro Beslic from Bratunac, prison warden in Gornji Potocar, 2. Ejup Golic, former shipper, from the village of Glogovo, 3. Sabrija Babajic, of father Mehmed, from the village of Glogovo, 4. Murat Ramic, of father Osman, from the village of Glogovo, 6. Camil Muratovic, from Cizmici, 7. Refik Babajic, of father Rama, from Glogovo. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of Mitrovic's son Jovan, filed with the Committee under number 560/94 and the document of the Basic Court in Zvornik Ki. 70/93 filed with the Committee under number 266/1-94. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Inhumane treatment of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: Srebrenica, 1992-February 1994. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: The witness, a 70 year old pensioner, lived with his wife in his family house in Srebrenica where he was born. When a great number of Serbs escaped from Srebrenica, where until the war 1/3 of the population had been Serb, the witness believed that was just a phase, and that life would become normal again. In the end only 21 persons of Serb nationality remained in Srebrenica. Life was difficult for Serbs. They were constantly exposed to various forms of abuse, especially by Moslem refugees who threw stones at Serb houses, demolished them, and often plundered them. Moslem military police searched the witness's house twice. The first time they searched his house they took all food he had, as well as medicines and other valuables. The second time, a police patrol consisting of Hajrus and Safet from Voljevica, searched his house and then came back the same day and took away his clothes, his wife's underwear, stockings, hygienic necessities. The two men continued visiting the witness another 6 evenings. They forced their entry every time by breaking the gate. The witness complained to the military police and commander Krdzic told him that he would "take necessary measures". The witness knew about the killing and maltreatment of other Serbs which is why he was afraid to leave his house during the day, so he went out only in the evening, while his wife had to wear long dresses like Moslem women to hide that she was a Serb. The witness finally left Srebrenica assisted by the Red Cross because he fell ill and required a surgery. In Srebrenica he left behind his real estate, a two- storey house (11x8m), a yard and an orchard. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Atif Krdzic from Osmaca, who was a policeman before the war, commander of the military police in Srebrenica, 2. Hakija Mehovic, commander of the military police in Srebrenica, 3. Hidajet Mustafic, from the surroundings of Skelani, member of the military police, 4-5. Safet and Hajrus, both from Voljevica, near Bratunac, members of the military police. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness of 30 August 1994, filed with the Committee under number 378/94-3. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Inhumane treatment of arrested persons - POWs. PLACE AND TIME: Srebrenica, the prison in the police building, September-October 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: The witness was arrested in his house in the village of Podravanje in an attack of the Moslem army and taken to a prison in Srebrenica. He was placed in a cell (2 x 2.5m) in which there were no beds or covers. In fact, there was no furniture in the cell. They could not lie down, because there were six of them in the cell, and guards kept spilling water on the floor, so that they stood or crouched all the time. The witness and other Serbs were beaten every day. The witness was beaten with boots, as a result of which his ribs were broken. This was done by Koljevic whose boots, as it occurred to the witness, were specially intended for beating, since they were strengthened with pointed boot legs, and the witness often lost consciousness after beating. The beating usually started at 10 p.m., and ended at 4 a.m. The witness was also beaten with electric cables, cords, metal pipes. He particularly had a difficult time when they burnt his hands with cigarettes made of walnut leaves. On one occasion Koljevic ordered him to strip naked, and burnt his penis with a cigarette. The witness lost consciousness. Seven of his teeth were knocked out - five in the upper and two in the lower jaw. Apart from Koljevic, he was also beaten by the guards Kemo, Beli and Dule. Guards often clogged the toilet, so that the witness and other prisoners had to put their hand in the opening. Several times they brought women and children from the town to the cell in which the witness was, and they spat on them and insulted them. They were not allowed to take a bath or to wash their faces ever, and when they asked to go to the toilet, it depended on guards whether they would go or not. If they let them go, they had to go out together, and they were beaten by guards in the corridor. This is why they had to avoid going to the toilet. They usually received food twice a day - leftovers from what guards ate. Occasionally they received tea with no sugar and a piece of bread of the size of a cigarette package. As they were not allowed to wash, sometimes they had to take bread with hands on which there were feces from the cleaning of the toilet. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Mirzet Koljevic, head of the police, 2. Naser Oric, commander of the Moslem army in Srebrenica, who beat the witness so hard that his left eye remained damaged as a result of a blow. 3-6. Guards Kemo from Pale near Sarajevo, Beli and Dule from Osmaca near Srebrenica, Cemo from Suceska. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness filed with the Committee under number 378/94-1. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing and inhuman treatment of the wounded and the sick PLACE AND TIME: Srebrenica, a prison located between the Town Hall and the Courthouse, January - February 1993. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: During a Moslem attack on Serbs in the village of Kusici, the witness, a student of the second year of high school was on holiday when she received a wound in her left hip while feeding the cattle with her mother. After that they were captured by the Moslems and taken away. But, since she was unable to walk on account of the wound, her mother carried her for two kilometers and then she was loaded on an oxen cart, took to Srebrenica and put into the prison between the Town Hall and the Courthouse. She stayed in the prison from January 16 till February 6, 1993. She lay on a stretcher and was completely unable to move. During the above stated period she had her wound dressed only once and was given a few pills. She was not taken to the hospital, which at the time existed in Srebrenica and was providing services. She and other inmates were given food only once a day consisting of a slice of bread and beans soup. The water was supplied in the least possible quantities depending on the mood the guards. They were not provided with any facilities for washing or taking a bath. Men were imprisoned in the adjacent room wherefrom guards' curses and wailing and howling from the inmates being beaten could frequently be heard. Owing to the effects of the inflicted wound and the untimely medical care, she had to spend four months in a hospital after the exchange and her leg remained shorter by 5 cm. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Zulko Turusovic, the prison commander in Srebrenica. EVIDENCE: The minutes from the hearing of the witness of August 30, 1994 filed with the Committee under No. 378/94-5. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of prisoners - prisoners of war. PLACE AND TIME: Gornja Kamenica, a village near Zvornik, 24 August 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: At about 6 a.m. on August 24, 1992, armed Moslem formations attacked the village of Gornja Kamenica. Most of the inhabitants managed to leave the village, but the following persons stayed behind: 1. Ljubomir Tomic 2. Dragomir Tomic, and 3. Milomir Kukolj, of father Veljko, all from Gornja Kamenica. After the arrest, members of the Moslem armed formations tortured and then killed the three mentioned persons. After the liberation of Gornja Kamenica on October 20, 1992, their bodies were found near a stable which belonged to Bo a Tomic. Their bones were broken, including their skulls, which proves that they were killed. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Esad Mehmedovic, former policeman from the village of Besici, the Milici Commune 2. Meho Suljagic, from Kamenica, the Zvornik Commune 3. Saban Redzic, former inspector of the Commune of Zvornik 4. Edo Haskic from Gornja Kamenica 5. Esad Haskic, from Gornja Kamenica 6. Ahmed Grebic, former policeman from Zvornik 7. Hazir Begic, former policeman from Zvornik 8. Esad Salkic 9. Muhamed Selimovic 10. Meho Suljic EVIDENCE: A document of the Basic Court in Zvornik, No. Kri. 71/93, filed with the Committee under No. 266/1-94 and document 378/94-19-23 including testimonies of B.V.,T.M., K.V., T.M. and K.T. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Willful killing and inhuman treatment of wounded and sick persons. PLACE AND TIME: Srebrenica, hospital, between July 24 and 27, 1993. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: Halilovic, as soldier of Moslem Armed formations, shot to death a civilian in the hospital. The civilian was Stojan Krsmanovic, nee 1924, from the village of Rekovac, the municipality of Bratunac. Krsmanovic was placed in the hospital after he had been captured and injured by Moslem armed units of Ejup Golic, when he was on his way home from Jelovac to Rekovac, unarmed. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Emir (Safet) Halilovic, barber by profession, from Srebrenica, born in the village of Budak, the municipality of Srebrenica. EVIDENCE: The documentation filed with the Committee under No. 371/94-1 and in the documents of the Basic Public Prosecutor's Office in Zvornik Kt. 9/94, where the records on autopsy performed by the physician of the out-patient health center in Bratunac are also filed. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Ethnic cleansing. PLACE AND TIME: Medje, a village near Srebrenica, May - August 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: On May 16, 1992 the commander of a Muslim armed formation, Beketic, came to the Serb village of Medje and, promising to the villagers that nothing would happen to them and that they could go on living and working in peace, he seized all their weapons and came again to the village on July 15, 1992 in the company of armed members of his unit and, on that occasion, killed: 1. Cvijetin Gagic, alias "Mato" , of father Srecko, 2. Velimir Simeunovic, of father Petar, 3. Radojka Simeunovic, of husband Velimir, 4. Milojko Gagic, 5. Milovan Gagic, 6. Ljubica Gagic, of husband Milovan, 7. Milena Gagic, of husband Milan, 8. Danica Gagic, of husband Djordje, 9. Milovan Andric, of father Sava, 10. Mladjen Subotic, of father Simeun, 11. Ilinka Subotic, of husband Milisav, 12. Manojlo Subotic, 13. Milena Subotic, wife of Manojlo, 14. Vidoje Subotic, of father Drago, 15. Andja Gagic, wife of Miladin, 16. Petar Gagic, 17. Petrija Andric, and 18. Radivoje Subotic, all from the village of Medja. Individuals were put behind the bars after they were transported by lorries from Medja to Srebrenica where they were locked up in the rooms of the former territorial defence HQs, subjected to torture and abuse, and then slaughtered; their bodies were exchanged on August 13. At the same time, Serb houses in this village were looted, cattle driven away and the houses and auxiliary buildings owned by the following set alight and destroyed: in the hamlet of Karan: Velimir Simeunovic, Mladjen Subotic, Manojlo Subotic, Vidoje Subotic, Milenko SUbotic, Cvijetin Gagic, Djordje Gagic, Milovan Gagic, Dragan gagic, Milenko Gagic,Petar Gagic, Vojislav Andric and Milovan Andric; in the hamlet of Radacevic: Pera Vasic, Ljeposava Vasic, Stanisa Vasic, Stevan Golic, Bo a Golic, Jova Todorovic, Radisav Gligic, Todor Todorovic, Nedja Jovanovic, Milenko Jovanovic, Milan Jovanovic, Jevdja Jovanovic, Zivko Jovanovic, Cvjetin Jovanovic, Draga Jovanovic, Jova Jovanovic, Dragan Jovanovic and Radoje Vasic; in the hamlet of Valtovic: Zivan Trifunovic, Milenko Trifunovic, Vlada Lukic, Steva Lukic, Mara Lukic, Vinka Lukic, Radisav Lukic, Zivko Lukic and Milan Lukic; in the hamlet of Crni Vrh: Radomir Djuric, Vojislav Djuric, Radivoj Jezdic, Krsta Petrovic, Petar Jovicic and Milka Petrovic. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Members of the Muslim armed formations under the command of Ned ad Bektic, former JNA lieutenant, born at Karadzici, commune of Srebrenica to father Rama and mother Zelja, a Muslim. EVIDENCE: Documentation filed with the Committee for Compiling Data on Crimes against Humanity and International Law under No. 371/94-2 and with the Basic Court at Zvornik under No. Ki.78/94.
    srebrenica_man - 72762 - 14.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (0)


    Ethnic Conflicts in Civil War in Bosnia - Political manipulation with term of Genocide (4)

    The Secretary General heavily criticized some media reports: Calling Bosnia Crisis Overrated, U.N. Chief Focuses on Africa By BARBARA CROSSETTE: "....The international press, he remarked in one of several interviews on his trip, made the battle for Srebrenica sound "like Stalingrad." "There is a kind of dialectical relation between the attention of a great power and the power of the media," he said. "It creates a distortion in our work. What I am trying to do, without great success, is to correct this distortion." Finally there were independent witnesses like UN Dutch troops. This is what they said about "mass killings": BBC Ceefax, 23 July 1995 23:59 BST: NO EVIDENCE OF MASS KILLINGS: DUTCH UN . Dutch UN peacekeepers in Srebrenica when the enclave fell to Bosnian Serb troops, have said they saw the summary execution of ten Bosnian Muslims. But Dutch commander Lt-Col Ton Karremans said he and his men had seen no evidence to corroborate reports from fleeing refugees of mass killings by Bosnian Serb troops. DIE WELT, 25.7.1995 By HELMUT HETZEL:".... Neither Struik nor other Dutch soldiers who were stationed in Srebrenica want to publicly confirm what minister of development- help Jan Pronk and later the minister of defense Joris Voorhoeve claimed: That genocide happened in Srebrenica..." The personal representative of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights was appointed to investigate what happened in Srebrenica and this is what he said: The Electronic Telegraph Monday 24 July 1995: SERB ATROCITIES IN SREBRENICA ARE UNPROVED By Tim Butcher in Tuzla: After five days of interviews the United Nations chief investigator into alleged human rights abuses during the fall of Srebrenica has not found any first-hand witnesses of atrocities... ....The lack of clear evidence facing Hubert Wieland, personal representative of the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, proved the near-impossibility of establishing what happened when the Serbs overran the Muslim enclave in eastern Bosnia. "Of course the whole ejection of a civilian population is an enormous abuse of human rights," Mr Wieland said yesterday. "But we have not found anyone who saw with their own eyes an atrocity taking place." ...Mr Wieland travelled to Tuzla, the Bosnian city where almost all of the Srebrenica refugees were taken, with a team of investigators to gather evidence of human rights abuses... He said his team had spoken to scores of Muslims at the main refugee camp at Tuzla airfield and at other collective centres but no first-hand witnesses had been found..... There is only one fact proven during the last two years after the Srebrenica story. The "massacre" in Srebrenica was just another masterpiece of the PR campaign done by Bosnian Muslim led government of Alija Izetbegovic. They did't care about sufferings of the people, death or destruction. For these Islamic fanatics only one goal has no price the creation of an Islamic Bosnia and Hercegovina. The Bosnian Serbs and Croats have realized Izetbegoivc's intentions and they fought against it. It is about time for the International Community to accept the reality. There will be no peace until the Bosnian Muslims who are responsible for lightning up the brutal Bosnia's civil war will stand in front of Hag's War Crimes Tribunal. It is time to get Alija Izetbegovic, Ejup Ganic, Rusmir Mahmutcehajic, Omer Behmen, Haris Silajdzic to stand and face the historical judgment. Their blindness (fanaticism) has created enormous disaster to the Bosnian Muslim people as well as for the Bosnian Serbs and Croats. It is time to pay the price for their religious fundamentalism. Bosnian Muslims who were considered by United Nations officials to be missing after the fall of the Srebrenica enclave have made their way through enemy lines to Bosnian Government territory in Zepa. This is an official message from the Zepa command to their main headquarters in town of Tuzla. It was never made public, although UN represenatives were informed about incoming Bosnian Muslim troops from UN battalion in Zepa. 30. Facsimile of Top secret Bosnian Muslim Army document REPUBLIC OF BOSNA I HERZEGOVINA DEFENCE OF THE REPUBLIC Bosnia and Herzegovina Army 22.07.1995 time: 14:20:00 2 CORPUS TUZLA for brigadier: DUDAKOVICH The members of the 28th Bosnian Muslim Mountain Battalion that came to Zepa on July 16, 1995.
    1. Sachirovich Mustafa 28 bb
    2. Malagich Safet 28 bb
    3. Dzanich Edhem-Klotjevac
    4. Muminovich Zurijet 28 bb
    5. Halilovich Sejdalija-Klotjevac
    6. Malagich Hamdija 28 bb
    7. Memich Suljo
    8. Mustafich Asmir 280 bb
    9. Bechirovich Ibro - Pomol
    10. Dzananovich Ibrisim 28 bb
    11. Bechirovich Salko - Pomol
    12. Ademovich Sakib 28 bb
    13. Huseinovic Avdija 28 bb
    14. Omerovich Sabit 28 bb
    15. Alic Fadil
    16. Zukanovich Hamid 28 bb
    17. Ahmetovic Sadik
    18. Jahich Ismet 28 bb
    19. Husic Husein 28 bb
    20. Dubicich Mefail 28 bb
    21. Hasanovic Sead 28 bb
    22. Salihovich Zulfer 28 bb
    23. Ibrahimovic Lutvo 28 bb
    24. Suljich Hariz 28 bb
    25. Beganovicc Ragib 28bb
    26. Bajramovich Ramo 28bb
    27. Delicc SSaban 28bb
    28. Osmanovich Kemo-VEZA 28 div.
    29. Junuzovic Edhem 28 bb
    30. Jusupovich Hasan 28 bb
    31. Malagic Nedzad 28 bb
    32. Husich Abid 28 bb
    33. Malagic Senahid 28 bb
    34. Omerovich Mefail 28 bb
    35. Malagic Mehmedalija 28 bb
    36. Mekanich (Osmana) Ibrahim 28 bb
    37. Kapidzic Suad 28 bb
    38. Muminovich Mevludin 28 bb
    39. Gerovic Meho 28 bb
    40. Ljeskovica Mirsad 28 bb
    41. Ramic Fikret 28 bb
    42. Beganovich Mesud 28 bb
    43. Golic Adil 28 bb
    44. Muminovich Vahdet 28 bb
    45. Beganovic Elvir 28 bb
    46. Mujic Nermin 28 bb
    47. Music Husnija 28 bb
    48. Hublich Hamzalija 28 bb
    49. Malagic Selmo 28 bb
    50. Bumbulovich Mehmed 28bb
    51. Music Bekir 28 bb
    52. Selimovich Sabahudin 28 bb
    53. Huseinovic Senad 28 bb
    54. Ahmedovich Bego 28 bb
    55. Salchinovic Hasim - Pusmulici
    56. Malcinovich Asim 28 bb
    57. Salchinovic Hazim - Pusmulici
    58. Omerovich Suad 28 bb
    59. Jufufovic Muhamed - Karachici
    60. Muminovich Kemal 28 bb
    61. Beganovic Zaim 28 bb
    62. Malagich Kemal 28 bb
    63. Hrustanovic Mujo - Miholjevine
    64. Ahmetovich Ahmet 28 bb
    65. Aljic Aljo-iz Dobraka
    66. Dzikanovich Fehim 28 bb
    67. Ibrahimovic Esed - iz Zgunje
    68. Aroich Ahmedin 28 bb
    69. Ibissevic Nedzad -iz Dobraka
    70. Halilovich Sejdalija 28 bb
    71. Ahmetovic Ahmet 28 bb
    72. Bechirovich Ibro 28 bb
    73. Bechirovich Salko 28 bb
    74. Husejnovich Avdija 28 bb
    75. Smajlovich Mehidin 28 bb
    76. Porobich Smail 28 bb
    77. Avdich (Alija) Hajro 28 bb
    78. Avdich (Mehmeda) Edin 28 bb
    79. Avdich (Hakije) Zijad 28 bb
    80. Kadrich (Fikreta) Mirsad 28 bb
    81. Selimovich (Hasib) Rizo 28 bb
    82. Mandzich (Ibrahim) Sabit 28 bb
    83. Avdich Ahmedin - civilian - Klotovac
    The following came to Zepa, as well:
    1. Dzananovich Velid from Zaluzja
    2. Beganovich Hamdija from Glogove
    3. Avdich Izet from Bratunca
    4. Huseinovich Mehmedalija from Glogove
    5. Hodzich Adis from Srebrenice
    6. Musich Remzija from Glogove
    7. Spiodich Dzevad from Srebrenice
    8. Beganovich Vejsil from Glogove
    9. Alich Fahrudin from Voljavice
    10. Ibisevich Ahmo from Sasa
    11. Hasanovich Senahid from Osmacca
    12. Salihovich Safet from Voljavice
    13. Hasich Munib from Srebrenice
    14. Jusich Kadrija from Voljavice
    15. Tabakovich Emin from Zaluzja
    16. Spiodich Ramo from Poljaka
    17. Halilovich Dzemal from Srebrenice
    18. Mahmutovich Mehmed from Bratunca 28.b.b
    19. Krdzich Bekto from Osmaca
    20. Spiodich Sado from Poljaka
    21. Ibisevich Hasan from Karacicha
    22. Softich Kadrija from Dobraka
    23. Mujich Jafaz from Srebrenice
    24. Salkich Besim from Zv-Kamenice
    Please let us know if Ejub Golic came to Tuzla. This is not a final list. The final one will be send in a few days, after we have all names collected. Major: /s/ Ramo Cardakovic Conclusion: It is possible to happen only in the Bosnian Muslim State The "missing civilians" from Srebrenica are able to be "unaccounted for two years" and still, to vote in the Bosnian elections held 1997! The following is a part of the list of 3010 "missing civilians" from Srebrenica that were participating in the Bosnia's election and are on the OSCE voting lists. Dr. Dragan Kalinic, President of the Republic of Srpska Parliament, presented this "paradox" to the OSCE and European Union.
    1. Abdurahmanovic Nezir Ismet
    2. Ademovic Ibrahim Kadir
    3. Ademovic Ismet Mevludin
    4. Ademovic Seban Saban
    5. Adic Camil Sadik
    6. Ahmetovic Avdo Dzevad
    7. Ajsic Ramo Adem
    8. Akagic Alia Sabahudin
    9. Alemic Alaga Mensur
    10. Alic Alaga Abaz
    11. Alic Nezir Ahmo
    12. Alic Semso Besim
    13. Alic Dzemal Dzevad
    14. Alic Ferid Fehim
    15. Alic Feazo Halil
    16. Alic Ohran Hasib
    17. Alic Alija Hebib
    18. Alic Mehmed Mujo
    19. Alic Ibrahim Nezir
    20. Alic Haso Nijaz
    21. Alic Hajrudin Reuf
    22. Alic Semso Sabahudin
    23. Alic Adem Samir
    24. Alic Sukrija Sead
    25. Alic Sukrija Seid
    26. Alic Jusuf Senahid
    27. Alihodzic Camil Ramadan
    28. Alispahic Hamdija Enver
    29. Alispahic Omer Mujo
    30. Aljic Ismet Nijaz
    31. Aljic Suljo Sabahudin
    32. Aljic Junuz Salko
    33. Aljic Suljo Seval
    34. Aljic Abdulah Zijad
    35. Atic Safet Ibro
    36. Atic Ibro Smajo
    37. Avdic Maso Alija
    38. Avdic Omer Almir
    39. Avdic Kadrija Bajazit
    40. Avdic Mustafa Fazlija
    41. Avdic Idriz Hajrudin
    42. Avdic Alija Hajrudin
    43. Avdic Nezir Kadir
    44. Avdic Dzemail Nevzet
    45. Avdic Avdo Ramiz
    46. Avdic Dzemal Refik
    47. Avdic Hasan Smail
    48. Avdic Smajo Suljo
    49. Bajramovic Suljo Azem
    50. Bajramovic Ikan Nedzad
    51. Bajramovic Ramo Nedzad
    52. Bajramovic Alija Ohran
    53. Bajramovic Ramo Semso
    54. Becic Husein Hajrudin
    55. Becic Ramo Ramiz
    56. Becirovic Mustafa Abdulah
    57. Becirovic Daut Dalija
    58. Becirovic Ramo Juso
    59. Becirovic Bahrija Nezir
    60. Beganovic Meho Mersed
    61. Begic Ibro Bego
    62. Begic Ahmo Hajdin
    63. Begic Salih Halid
    64. Begic Saban Halid
    65. Begic Alija Mehmedalija
    66. Begic Salih Nezir
    67. Begic Enez Nedzad
    68. Begic Sacir Nusret
    69. Begic Asim Zikrija
    70. Begovic Ahmo Huso
    71. Bektic Enes Dzelil
    72. Bektic Jusuf Ejub
    73. Bektic Adil Esed
    74. Bektic Adem Ibrahim
    75. Bektic Mustafa Jusuf
    76. Bektic Sead Kiram
    77. Bektic Mujo Munib
    78. Bektic Salko Sakib
    79. Bektic Ibrahim Sead
    80. Bektic Nail Suad
    81. Bektic Huso Suad
    82. Bektic Ahmo Sulejman
    83. Bitinovic Abdulah Sabahudin
    84. Bitinovic Abdulah Sevludin
    85. Borogovac Nurdin Emir
    86. Brdarevic Ahmo Admir
    87. Brdarevic Camil Hamed
    88. Brdarevic Taib Vahid
    89. Budovic Huso Bajro
    90. Buljubasic Ismet Bajro
    91. Buljubasic Avdija Elvir
    92. Buljubasic Ismet Hamdija
    93. Buljubasic Avdija Hasan
    94. Buljubasic Vehbija Mirsad
    95. Buljubasic Avdija Senad
    96. Bumbulovic Asim Adem
    97. Bumbulovic Meho Fikret
    98. Bumbulovic Omer Junuz
    99. Bumbulovic Hasan Hasib
    100. Bumbulovic Salih Husein
    101. Buric Salih Rifet
    102. Cakanovic Cazim Adis
    103. Cakanovic Hilmo Cazim
    104. Cakanovic Cazim Hazim
    105. Camdzic Hasan Habib
    106. Camdzic Mustafa Resid
    107. Camdzic Juho Samir
    108. Catic Husein Junuz
    109. Catic Osman Semo
    110. Civic Zuhdo Hedib
    111. Cvrk Hasan Meho
    112. Dautbasic Avdo Sacir
    113. Dautovic Alaga Azem
    114. Delic Selim Azem
    115. Delic Alija Ejup
    116. Delic Edhem Ekrez
    117. Delic Hasan Enes
    118. Delic Selim Eniz
    119. Delic Hamed Hajrudin
    120. Delic Hasan Ibro
    121. Delic Habib Izet
    122. Delic Enes Kadrija
    123. Delic Meho Sead
    124. Delic Ohran Zijad
    125. Delic Salcin Taib
    126. Dervisevic Bego Bekto
    127. Dervisevic Idriz Vahdet
    128. Divovic Hakija Elvedin
    129. Divovic Ramo Salko
    130. Dizdarevic Avdo Haso
    131. Dizdarevic Hedib Huso
    132. Djogaz Hasan Nusret
    133. Djogaz Salcin Salko
    134. Djogaz Ahmo Vahid
    135. Djozic Mensur Esad
    136. Djozic Senusica Fuad
    137. Djozic Asim Mensur
    138. Djozic Alija Sadik
    139. Djozic Edhem Semir
    140. Dudic Husein Ibro
    141. Dudic Husein Sadik
    142. Durakovic Haso Alija
    143. Durakovic Miralem Musan
    144. Durakovic Haso Sead
    145. Dzananovic Dzemal Azem
    146. Dzananovic Nezir Dzemal
    147. Dzananovic Nezir Ibrahim
    148. Dzananovic Hikrija Mujko
    149. Dzananovic Juso Mirzet
    150. Dzananovic Avdo Mustafa
    151. Dzananovic Kasim Zikret
    152. Dzanic Ibro Edin
    153. Djogaz Mustafa Omer
    154. Djogaz Salko Salcin
    155. Djozic Huso Beriz
    156. Efendic Husein Avdo
    157. Efendic Hajrulah Bahrudin
    158. Efendic Fadil Mesud
    159. Efendic Husein Mevludin
    160. Efendic Resid Resid
    161. Ejubovic Alija Amir
    162. Ejubovic Ibrahim Avdo
    163. Ejubovic Muharem Behadil
    164. Ejubovic Alija Ejub
    165. Ejubovic Ibro Ibrahim
    166. Ejubovic Mehmedalija Mehmed
    167. Ejubovic Mehmedalija Mevlid
    168. Feazic Fadil Mustafa
    169. Feazic Nezir Nesib
    170. Feazic Ibrahim Saban
    171. Feazic Sakib Safer
    172. Feazic Ahmet Sakib
    173. Feazic Orhan Senaid
    174. Gabeljic Suljo Abid
    175. Gabeljic Rasid Asim
    176. Gabeljic Rasid Atif
    177. Gabeljic Juso Avdo
    178. Gabeljic Azim Fahrudin
    179. Gabeljic Hasim Hamdija
    180. Gabeljic Azem Hasan
    181. Gabeljic Rasim Huso
    182. Gabeljic Suljo Ibro
    183. Gabeljic Ibrahim Jusuf
    184. Gabeljic Abdulah Meho
    185. Gabeljic Atif Mustafa
    186. Gabeljic Nezir Nijaz
    187. Gabeljic Husein Ramiz
    188. Gabeljic Hasan Sead
    189. Gabeljic Rasim Zijad
    190. Garaljevic Enes Enver
    191. Garaljevic Mehmed Sakib
    192. Gurdic Ahmet Ahmo
    193. Gurdic Ahmo Mesud
    194. Gurdic Bego Sadik
    195. Hadzibulic Bajro Mevludin
    196. Hadzibulic Teufik Bajro
    197. Hafizovic Ahmet Vahid
    198. Hajdarevic Alaga Kadrija
    199. Haadarevic Sukrija Mehmed
    200. Haadarevic Sukrija Mirzet
    201. Hakic Vejsil Elvir
    202. Hakic Hamdija Nurdin
    203. Hakic Hajro Nurdin
    204. Hakic Ramiz Senad
    205. Halilovic Abid Halid
    206. Halilovic Himzo Hamid
    207. Halilovic Bajro Ibro
    208. Halilovic Alija Mehmedalija
    209. Halilovic Omer Memis
    210. Halilovic Junuz Mirsad
    211. Halilovic Safet Mustafa
    212. Halilovic Osmo Nurdih
    213. Halilovic Huso Rasid
    214. Halilovic Idriz Saban
    215. Halilovic Saban Sado
    216. Halilovic Memis Samir
    217. Halilovic Izet Seadalija
    218. Halilovic Ibro Sulejman
    219. Halilovic Halid Zijad
    220. Halilovic Nurif Zurijet
    221. Hamzic Aljo Mevlid
    222. Hamzic Ahmet Mirsad
    223. Hamzic Salih Salcin
    224. Hanic Redzep Selim
    225. Harbas Ragib Sakib
    226. Hasankovic Hasan Nedzad
    227. Hasanovic Amil Alaga
    228. Hasanovic Huso Edhem
    229. Hasanovic Zahir Esed
    230. Hasanovic Juso Hajdin
    231. Hasanovic Seafo Hajro
    232. Hasanovic Ahmet Hamdija
    233. Hasanovic Hasan Hamdija
    234. Hasanovic Hasan Hazim
    235. Hasanovic Salcin Jusuf
    236. Hasanovic Ibrahim Mehmed
    237. Hasanovic Alija Mehmedalija
    238. Hasanovic Ramo Meho
    239. Hasanovic Ibrahim Mevludin
    240. Hasanovic Ramo Mirsa
    241. Hasanovic Hamed Nermin
    242. Hasanovic Selman Saban
    243. Hasanovic Kadrija Semir
    244. Hasanovic Hakija Senad
    245. Hasanovic Husein Senahid
    246. Hasanovic Alaga Suljo
    247. Hasanovic Dzemal Vahdet Fahret
    248. Hasic Mustafa Osman
    249. Hirkic Maho Ahmo
    250. Hirkic Bajro Behadil
    251. Hirkic Halid Beris
    252. Hirkic Suljo Halid
    253. Hirkic Osman Jusuf
    254. Hirkic Ahmo Maho
    255. Hirkic Husein Sabahudin
    256. Hodzic Husein Farid
    257. Hodzic Mujo Abdulah
    258. Hodzic Kadir Aziz
    259. Hodzic Suljo Fikret
    260. Hodzic Salko Husein
    261. Hodzic Sahmo Sabit
    262. Hodzic Sahim Smail
    263. Hotic Sead Samir
    264. Hotic Hasan Sead
    265. Hozbo Muradif Sakib
    266. Hrustanovic Ismet Hazim
    267. Hrustanovic Ismet Rifet
    268. Hrustanovic Ahmo Tahir
    269. Hrustic Sahim Azem
    270. Hublic Ibrahim Hazim
    271. Hublic Fadil Teufik
    272. Hukic Husein Ahmet
    273. Hukic Gajibija Edhem
    274. Hukic Redzo Esed
    275. Hukic Tahir Mujo
    276. Hukic Hajdin Senad
    277. Huremovic Hasib Mehmed
    278. Huremovic Mesan Samir
    279. Huseinovic Omer Emir
    280. Huseinovic Nezir Mirsad
    281. Huseinovic Izet Suljo
    282. Huseanagic Fehim Redzep
    283. Huseanovic Atif Hajrudin
    284. Huseanovic Omer Ismet
    285. Huseanovic Ibro Munib
    286. Huseanovic Hajrudin Nermin
    287. Huseanovic Ibrahim Osman
    288. Husic Mujo Bahjija
    289. Husic Hasan Esad
    290. Husic Mujo Himzo
    291. Husic Ibrahim Mehmed
    292. Husic Mehmed Mujo
    293. Ibisevic Salih Bekir
    294. Ibisevic Ibis Ekrem
    295. Ibisevic Ahmo Samir
    296. Ibisevic Salih Sead
    297. Ibisevic Sevko Sefedin
    298. Ibisevic Salih Seid
    299. Ibrahimovic Dzemal Bego
    300. Ibrahimovic Omer Dzemail
    301. Ibrahimovic Omer Dzemal
    302. Ibrahimovic Nefail Emir
    303. Ibrahimovic Haso Enver
    304. Ibrahimovic Zuhdo Hasib
    305. Ibrahimovic Omer Haso
    306. Ibrahimovic Ahmet Ibrahim
    307. Ibrahimovic Dzemal Kemal
    308. Ibrahimovic Zuhrijet Mevlid
    309. Ibrahimovic Fikret Mirzet
    310. Ibrahimovic Mehmed Muhamed
    311. Ibrahimovic Nuria Nedzad
    312. Ibrahimovic Nuria Nurdin
    313. Ibrahimovic Zulfo Sabahudin
    314. Ibrahimovic Ahmet Sahman
    315. Ibrahimovic Smail Semso
    316. Ibrahimovic Zaim Zahir
    317. Idrizovic Salko Hasan
    318. Imsirevic Arif Muharem
    319. Jahic Ramo Hasib
    320. Jahic Mehmed Saib
    321. Jahic Salko Vehbija
    322. Jakubovic Nezir Bego
    323. Jakubovic Husein Ekrem
    324. Jakubovic Esed Amir
    325. Jasarevic Ismet Ahmet
    326. Jukic Hadzo Irfan
    327. Jukic Mehmed Mehmedalija
    328. Junuzagic Zahir Mirza
    329. Jusic Mustafa Mujo
    330. Jusic Mujo Munir
    331. Jusic Hasib Sadik
    332. Jusic Juso Sulejman
    333. Jusufovic Salcin Camil
    334. Jusufovic Salcin Ramiz
    335. Kabilovic Salko Mehmed
    336. Kabilovic Bego Nesib
    337. Kadric Juso Jusuf
    338. Kadric Sado Kadrija
    339. Kadric Kadrija Nurdin
    340. Kadric Kadrija Nurija
    341. Kalic Hamid Bekir
    342. Kalic Idriz Muris
    343. Kandzetovic Bekto Behaja
    344. Kardasevic Ramo Mehan
    345. Klancevic Halid Sead
    346. Klempic Sevko Amir
    347. Klempic Edhem Kadrija
    348. Klempic Muso Zulfo
    349. Krdzic Ramo Behudin
    350. Krdzic Baro Izet
    Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's Muslim operational army group. 31. International Red Cross Commettee List of Missing persons -Examples of manipulations The Lists of missing persons are from ICRC documentation. Bolded names represented found persons, which mean that they can't be treated and notice as missing. There are more than thousand persons found on the same matter, what cause suspicion to IRCR list. Principe is next: Persons were founding upon Top secret and confidential documents of Bosnia Muslim Army. For this book needs, we separate just one part of informations about so called missing people from Srebrenica. On that way we make example with list of people with family names which beginning with capital B. The data contain following informations: 1) Basic informations about person - ICRC 2) Informations from Army of Muslim - Croatian Federation. 3) Registration numbers and data from main document 4) Conclusion. All this data showing us manipulations with numbers of so called missing people from Srebrenica in July 1995. EXAMPLE: Mr. Ademovic Adem from father Zulfu is on list of missing persons of ICRC from July 1995. But true is that Mr. Ademovic Adem was on list of missing and killed persons of Bosnia Muslim Army during the combat 12.9.1992. Informations about that is from secret Bosnia Muslim Army documentations, Basic data from registration list of international organizations: Full name: BECO JOHIC Sex: male DOB.POB 12th May 1972, Rovasi, Vlasenica Data from documents of Moslem Croatian Federation: BECO (SULJO) JOHIC, born 1972 in Rovasi Vlasenica. Killed on 15th March 1993, in village Baljkovica, Zvornik Registration numberand data from original document: List of killed and disappeared soldiers on the territory Debelo Brdo and Baljkovica from 284.IBL brigade Srebrenica Conclusion: Killed on 15th March 1992, before July 1995 Basic data from registration list of international organizations Full name: HAMDIJA JASAREVIC Sex: male DOB.POB: 15th May 1963, Macesi, Vlasenica Data from documents of Moslem Croatian Federation HAMDIJA (AVDO) JASAREVIC, born 1963 in Vlasenica, Disappeared on 6th July 1993 in Ruzina Voda, Vlasenica, on the road to Tuzla Registration number and data from original document: List of killed and disappeared soldiers on the territory Debelo Brdo and Baljkovica from 284.IBL brigade Srebrenica Conclusion: Disappeared on 6th July 1993, before July 1995 32. Testemonies of surviviors On October 5, 1992, Moslem armed formations attacked the house of Sreten Djokic in the village of Divovici near Bratunac, and two days later the bodies of the people killed in Divovici were handed over to the Serbs. The body of Sreten Djokic was given without the head and the right arm. On the neck hung a patch of skin with hair from the top of his head. The head and the arm were never found and the body was buried without them. Proof: 37/94-6 . In clashes between Moslem armed forces and those of the Army of the Republic of Srpska on November 5,1992 in the area of Kamenica, the commune of Zvornik, the Moslems captured and killed by beheading Vlado Grabovica, Savo Djokic, Dragomir Bozic, Slavko Tijanic, Savo Kazanovic and Radomir Pavlovic. Dragomir Bozic was massacred and the head severed from the body. The head of Slavko Tijanic was found without the eyes, ears and nose, a 6 mm diameter iron bar was found in his chest, while his neck, hands and feet were tied with wire. The head of Savo Kazanovic had also been cut off, his chest pierced with a large nail, and he himself nailed to an oak tree and crucified. A head without the body was also found which is assumed to have belonged to Milos Grabovica. The following were also killed in Kamenica on November 5,1992: Miladin Asceric, 28 years old; Mico Tesic, 24 years old and Nikola Milinovic, 27 years old. They were also beheaded. Proof: 184/94-5, 184/95-6, 184/95-7 and 184/95-8. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. In an attack carried out on June 3,1992 on the village of Brezane, the commune of Srebrenica, Moslems killed Milivoje Mitrovic and Stanoje Mitrovic. When this village was liberated in April 1993 their headless bodies were found. One peroson with nickname "Kemo" from Pale had slit Stanoje Mitrovic's throat. Proof: 635/94-9. On September 24,1992 Moslem forces occupied the village of Podravanje in the commune of Milici, set it to fire, looted it and killed all the wounded whom they found in the village. They killed 19 persons on that occasion and massacred their bodies. Zulfo Tursumovic from Suceska had the severely wounded Tomislav Perendic put his head in his (Tursumovic's) lap and then slaughtered him and cut his head off. Svetozar Jovanovic's head was cut off and impaled on a stake and Gojko Tomic was beheaded and his head thrown some 20 metres away from the body. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Divovici, the commune of Bratunac, September-October 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: When the war broke out in Croatia, the Moslems from this village started provoking the Serbs. In early September 1992, the husband of the witness, Sreten Djokic, was attacked while he was picking plumbs near their house, hit by an object in the back of his head after which he fell and lost consciousness. After that he was taken to the Uzice hospital for treatment. The witness learned that he had been attacked by Moslems who had left him behind believing that he had been dead. On 5 October, after her husband returned from the hospital, the witness and her husband were at home. At one moment Sreten went to the stable to feed the cows, when the witness heard shots and her son yelling "Dad fell". Then she saw her husband lying motionless five meters away from the house on the way to the stable. Fifty meters away she saw Hasanovic with a rifle, cursing her Chetnik mother, ordering her to get out of her house where she hid with her son. Soon after that, a flammable device was thrown into the house causing fire, and the witness and her son started suffocating. Her son jumped out of the window, and the witness heard shots and saw the perpetrators running after her son. She then ran to the opposite direction to a nearby forest. Two days later, on 7 October, the bodies of those who were killed in Divovici were given to Serbs. The witness saw the body of her son Svetozar, with the right eye plucked out, the right arm broken, a wound on the right side of his chest, and a number of holes on his shirt, probably as a result of stabbing. The body of her husband was decapitated and without the right arm. A piece of his skin with hair taken from his head was hanging down his neck. His head and arm were not found and the body was buried without them. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Izet Hasanovic, 2. Haris Ridjic, of father Munib, 3. Edem Mahmutovic, sixty years of age, whom the witness saw taking a cow and a goat out of her stable during the attack. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness Savka Djokic, of 31 August 1994, filed with the Committee under number 378/94-6 and medical documentation (Dr. Stankovic). DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: Visegrad, 24 July 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: On 24 July Ranko Samardzic, born 23 April 1931, of father Pero, was killed in Visegrad near his house by Moslem soldiers. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Kemal Isic, a Moslem soldier from Visegrad, 2. Ibrahim Susko, from Visegrad, 3. Hasan Veletovac, from Visegrad. EVIDENCE: Committee 440/94-27 NOTE: Supplement to application I-139. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Jelasci, the commune of Visegrad, 1 August 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: In the night of 2 August Moslem military troops attacked the village of Jelasci and shot the following civilians: 1. Milo Savic, born in 1943, of father Gvozden, 2. Petka Savic, born in 1945 of father Dragomir, 3. Radomir Savic, born in 1949, of father Gvozden, 4. Dragan Susnjar, born in 1928, of father Jovan, 5. Slavka Susnjar, born in 1930, 6. Trivun Jelicic, born in 1929, of father Velizar, 7. Sava Jelicic, born in 1920, 8. Mirjana Jelicic, born 1960, of father Miloje, 9. Dragana Jelicic, 8 years old, 10. Vidoje Jelicic, 11 years old. The victims were killed in their homes or leaving their houses. Each of them had several bullet shots on their bodies. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Ahmed Sejdic, from Visegrad, commander of a Moslem military unit. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witnesses filed with the Committee under numbers 440/94-36 and 440/94-40. NOTE: Supplement to application I-139. Some of the war crimes that are reported to the UN and listed by the case and proof number. All Bosnian Muslim units were from Srebrenica's operational Muslim army group. DESIGNATION OF CRIME: Deliberate killing of civilians. PLACE AND TIME: The village of Vlahovici, the commune of Visegrad, 9 June 1992. BRIEF DESCRIPTION: A group of Moslem soldiers killed the following civilians from the village of Vlahovici on 9 June in a field called Krcevina: 1. Dragomir Simsic, born in 1949, of father Momcilo, 2. Perka Simsic, maiden name Gogic, born in 1941, of father Vitomir, and 3. Bozo Simsic, born in 1932, of father Obren. Dragomir and Perka Simsic were killed by Bajic and Sabanovic from fire arms, and Bozo Simsic was both shot and slaughtered by Hurem. INDICATIONS CONCERNING PERPETRATOR: 1. Hamdo Bajic, from Velika Gostilja, the commune of Visegrad, of father Asim and mother Mejrema, 2. Adil Sabanovic, from Mala Gostilja, the commune of Visegrad, born on 27 November 1972 in Visegrad, of father Rifet, 3. Ragib Hurem, called Rapce, from Mala Gostilja, the commune of Visegrad, born on 24 September 1960, of father Ragib and mother Hajra. EVIDENCE: Minutes from the hearing of the witness and an application of the public security station in Visegrad, Ku. 6/93, filed with the Committee under number 440/94-35. NOTE: Supplement to application I-139.
    srebrenica_man - 72760 - 14.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (0)


    Ethnic Conflicts in Civil War in Bosnia -Political manipulation with term of Genocide (3)

    Missing List It is said that as many as 6,000 - 8,000 Muslim men were executed by Bosnian Serb forces. However, this figure is evidently inflated. There are several factors that expand the actual figure. First factor is the high ratio of Muslim women to military capable men in a family. In general, the average number of women are about 3 or 4, the grandmother, the mother, the wife, and a sister in a Muslim family, usually consisting of more than 8 members. On the other hand, the number of military capable men is 1 or 2, the father if he is young enough and a brother if he is old enough. Therefore, if one of the military capable men becomes missing, three women anxious about the fate of their beloved one would report to ICRC individually as a missing person. The name could be slightly changed because a nickname is sometimes more popular than the real name. Thus, the number of missing persons would become two-fold. When the author visited Muslim women that were living in Sarajevo as refugees from Srebrenica, more than ten women came in order to ask the author to find the whereabouts of the two men. Another factor is the desperate efforts of Muslim women from Srebrenica to support their lives. Having arrived in Kladanj and Tuzla either by the bus evacuation at the fall of Srebrenica or by some other means before the fall of Srebrenica, Muslim women obtained Identity Card of a citizen of Kladanj or Tuzla. However, as they moved mostly to Sarajevo, they got another Identity Card of Sarajevo. Thus, they are able to secure aid in Kladanj / Tuzla as well as aid in Sarajevo. One of the Muslim women that the author met in Sarajevo whispered secretly, saying that she had two Identity Cards to receive the aid twice. Next factor is the intention of Muslim government to manipulate the election in Srebrenica. According to the document compiled by the local Serbs in Srebrenica, about 3,500 Muslim names registered as voters in 1997 had not been the persons who used to live in Srebrenica. All 3,500 names that the author saw in their letter of complaint to OSCE were female names. False registration gave the election victory of Srebrenica to Muslim government, and gave aid to women registered falsely. All three factors also become the reasons why so many Muslim women said that their beloved ones had been killed in Srebrenica. Moreover, there were a number of names without date of birth in the missing list. These names amount as much as about 3,381 out of 6,610 who became missing at the fall of Srebrenica. Since it is strange that close relative did not know the birth date of their beloved in registering , there must be some factor which tried to manipulate the figure of the victims. Another factor is efforts of Muslim soldiers to conceal their identity in order to avoid the war criminal charge from Bosnian Serb forces. They gave the false identifies to international organizations when they wanted to get out of Srebrenica, and they gave their real name when they arrived at a Muslim territory. Thus, false identities remained in the missing list. In Srebrenica, the author noticed that some of the names on grave stones were identical with the names in the missing list. Probably, they used the names of their dead friends or relatives. According to Report of the Secretary-General Pursuant to Security Council Resolution 1019 (1995) on Violations of International Humanitarian Law in the Areas of Srebrenica, Zepa, Banja Luka and Sanski Most (27 November 1995), out of the first tracing requests from families, which amounted to 10,000, 2,000 were found duplicative, and 5,000 were found to be persons who had left the enclave before the fall of Srebrenica. Thus, the remaining requests amounts to approximately 3,000, and ICRC recently listed 3,290 as persons who became missing on the fall of Srebrenica. However, the author found that 180 tracing requests in the ICRC missing list were also for the persons who had left the enclave before the fall of Srebrenica. Consequently , the number of tracing requests results in 3,110 missing persons. Moreover, almost 1000 out of the 3,110 tracing requests were found to be for the persons who had been dead before the fall of Srebrenica or for the persons who had left the enclave earlier, according to the investigation of the document which Muslim forces left in Srebrenica. It should be noted that this document is 45,000 pages long and that only the Commission of Legal Experts has checked less than forty percent of the document to Republika Srpska. Thus, more persons will be eliminated from the remaining 2,110 tracing requests. If the number of invalid tracing requests is found at this rate by the further check of the document, the number of the valid tracing requests is expected to be 2,000 - 2,500 at most eventually. Out of this number, roughly 1,800 Muslim soldiers are estimated to be killed during combats in fleeing, judging from military perspectives, and probably another 100 persons had died of physical conditions while fleeing. In addition, persons who were given asylum in Yugoslavia and other countries and persons who came back alive much later either after hiding themselves for a long time or after being exchanged as prisoners of war must be deleted from the tracing requests. Moreover, Muslim government immediately transferred about 6,000 soldier who arrived at Zenica and Tuzla to another front line in Bosnia without giving any access to their families . Their families of these 6,000 would request ICRC to trace them because the families did not know that their beloved ones had arrived. Thus, a certain number of soldiers among those 6,000 must be deleted from the names of persons who became missing in Srebrenica. As a consequence, the remaining figure in the missing list would be the number of Muslim soldiers who were executed by Bosnian Serb forces for personal revenge or for simple ignorance of the international law. It would probably stand less than 100. Erdemovic Although Erdemovic (a Croat) appeared to be the only substantial evidence for the alleged systematic ethnic cleansing of Bosnian Serb forces, it has not been well-known that Yugoslav government submitted him to ICTY after it had diagnosed him as being mentally sick. When he confessed in Yugoslavia that he executed more than 70 Muslims by ABC broadcast in May 1996, Yugoslav police immediately arrested him in order to investigate. However, as his statement and behavior had many contradictions, the doctors diagnosed him as mental disease. It should be also noted that he used to fight as a member of Muslim forces, then as a member of Croatian forces, and finally as Bosnian Serb forces during the war . This inconsistency of his military history raises the question of the adequacy to stand as a witness for mass execution. Consequence of Alleged Srebrenica Massacre and Collective Responsibility of Serbs Reappearance of Muslim War Criminals in 1998 In 1997, the local election was held in Srebrenica under the supervision of OSCE, and Muslims won the election. According to the document compiled by the local Serbs in Srebrenica, however, about 3500 Muslim names registered as voters were not the persons who used to live in Srebrenica. Although the local Serbs filed the complaint, OSCE ignored. As a result, the local Serbs decided not to recognize the legitimacy of the Assembly. Meanwhile, some newly elected Muslim assemblymen came to Srebrenica in 1998 in order to attend the assembly under the heavy protection of SFOR. However, local Serbs immediately recognized one of the so-called elected Muslims by face as a criminal that killed two women and a handicapped man in a wheelchair in Loznica village in 1992. When the author visited Srebrenica, one of local Serbs said to himself that he would not be able to live in Srebrenica if the international society would bring back those criminals. The deputy chief of the local Bosnian Serb police, who had to cooperate with SFOR to protect the war criminal, said to the author's interpreter in a despair that his job was to arrest criminals and to protect general people. He added impassively that he might quit the job. Yet, there are almost no jobs in Srebrenica. In Tuzla, a Muslim territory, there are troubles between Muslims who once escaped to Germany from Tuzla during the war and Muslims who started to live in Tuzla after the war. According to UNHCR, the current Muslim residents do not allow their fellow returnees to come back to Tuzla. This conflict may result from the fall of Srebrenica. When Srebrenica fell in July 1995, about 6,000 of the most savage segment of Bosnian Army in Srebrenica took the advantage of the corridor that Mladzic opened, and arrived at Tuzla . According to local media in those days, new comers from Srebrenica were reported to kill and beat up the original residents in order to take their houses. As they are still free to do anything now, they would do anything in order to refuse their fellow Muslim returnees from Germany. In 1998, it is said that Naser Oric is now in Kosovo as a mercenary. As he used to be a policeman in Belgrade, several former colleagues recognized him. In addition, a Kosovo Albanian who was arrested as a fighter of UCK, Kosovo Liberation Army, confessed that Naser Oric was in Kosovo together with about 50 Muslim soldiers from Srebrenica. Unlike international conflicts, civil war often give the opportunities that people like bandits will become main players. If you apply black and white picture on a civil war like the war in Bosnia, and overlook the crimes of those bandits, saying that they are victims, the troubles will spill over and you may increase the sorrow of the general public. Quasi-Protectorate of Republika Srpska Aleged massacre of Muslims gave a dreadful blow to Republika Srpska. It lost political and military leaders as ICTY indicted Karadzid and Mladic, and had to start building the entity without the leadership. Taking the advantage of the situation, the international society have filled the space, using SFOR's arrests as a whip on one hand, and financial aid as a carrot on the other. Under the whip and the carrot, the political body began to disintegrate, and Republika Srpska has become a quasi-protectorate of some foreign country. Domestic judicial system was completely ignored, and a war criminal suspect, Drjeca was killed by SFOR by the "secret indictment" of ICTY the under the name of justice although he had hardly resisted unlike SFOR's statement. People has become very vulnerable, having been exposed to the risk of a sudden arrest for the crimes that they did not know. The air in Republika Srpska became stifling among the general citizens of Bosnian Serbs. When the election was held, IPC declined to release the election results for more than two weeks under the name of democracy. The final results of the election that might be manipulated during this period have brought about war criminals as elected assembly men in Srebrenica, and other places. Being afraid of criminals' comeback to the neighborhood, a certain portion of general citizens of Bosnian Serbs have started to look for a life in other countries. The fate of the entity of Bosnian Serbs is dwindling. Collective Responsibility of Serbs Alleged Srebrenica massacre hit Yugoslavia hard as well as Republika Srpska. As uncomfirmed information on the massacre of Muslim soldiers in Srebrenica created a monstrous image of blood-thirsty Serbs as the collective body so firmly, almost everything has been looked at through the filter of this image. Thus, in almost every case, the Serbs are judged as an evil from the beginning. For instance, in media reports on Kosovo, the most frequent words that have been used are "Serbs cannot repeat the massacre of Bosnia" based in the alleged Srebrenica massacre. This imprinting process of the formidable image might push Serbs onto an isolated corner of the world for an unexpectedly long period. Therefore, to clarify the alleged Srebrenica massacre is considered to be one of the most urgent tasks to save Serbs' fate. Important: There is supporting documentations of this Report. In total there is 40 000 pages of Top Secret Muslims documentation's confiscate during the liberation of Srebrenica. Supporting documentation's include:
  • Photo-documentation's;
  • Video tapes;
  • Report of Holland soldiers;
  • Reports of Republic of Srpska;
  • Testimony of victims and witness;
  • Documentations of Muslim Army;
  • Report of Muslims newspaper;
  • Statements of representatives from international organizations;
  • Other evidences; 29. Role of so called international media's in creation of political manipulation of term of Genocide - SREBRENICA It has been five years since the Bosnian Serb Army (BSA) has retaken the small town of Srebrenica - The Economist, 15-21 July 1995 Call that safe? "....It is not the first time that the Serbs have "liberated" Srebrenica. In 1992, during the first weeks of the Bosnian war, they also took the town but were driven out. Later, in blazing sunshine, Muslims and Serbs sat down in the middle of the road to hammer out a peace deal. The Serbs offered Srebrenica's Muslims autonomy within the Bosnian Serb republic, but that was rejected. Since then the war in eastern Bosnia has seen the most vicious fighting in the benighted republic..." - and it is the right time to give a hystorical retrospective of the events that have happened in the area during Bosnia's civil war. How did it start? As every other civil war, with the killing of the neighbours. Two Bosnian Muslims, accused by the Republica Srpska for the war crimes, Naser Oric (commander of the Bosnian Muslim Army - BMA - in Srebrenica) and Hakija (Husein) Meholjic organized on May 18,1992 killing of the Bosnian Serb, Goran (Drago) Zekic, who was deputy in the Bosnia-Hercegovina Assembly . Shortly after, the BMA, led by Naser Oric, Hakija (Husein) Meholjic, Zulfo "Suceska" Tursunovic and Akif (Enez) Ustic have attacked a several Bosnian Serb villages in Srebrenica's area. The following Bosnian Serbs villages were burned and destroyed: Osredak May 1992, Oparke June 01,1992, Zagora July 05,1992, Zalezje July 12, 1992 Pajici and Hrahna July 25, 1992, Brezani July 30, 1992, Fakovici October 1992, Kravice January 07, 1993 (Christmas Day for the Orthodox Bosnian Serbs). Then the BSA strikes back and as the result of that counter-offensive, on April 16, 1993, the Security Council adopted Resolution 819, which designated the enclave around Srebrenica a "safe heaven". Two days latter, the BSA commander, Gen. Ratko Mladic, joined his BMA counterpart in agreeing to the demilitarization of Srebrenica. The following are quotations from various sources and published articles that will explain more in-depth how "demilitarized safe area of Srebrenica" acctualy was: The Times, 14 July 1995 Muslim soldiers 'failed to defend town from Serbs' By Michael Evans, Defence Correspondent: "......Srebrenica was officially demilitarized on April 17, 1993, but the government soldiers were not short of weapons. Before the Serb advance on the town, the Muslims had been shelling Serb units along the main road to the south. The intelligence sources said it was that harassment which precipitated the Serb attack on the 1,500 Muslim defenders inside the enclave...." The Economist, 15-21 July 1995 Call that safe?: ...."Safe" Srebrenica was supposed to be demilitarized but this did not stop Mr Oric's soldiers from raiding nearby Serb villages. A recent raid, occurring soon after the collapse of the heavy-weapons exclusion zone around Sarajevo, plus the slow gathering of the West's reaction force, gave General Ratko Mladic, the Bosnian Serb commander, the reasons he needed for extracting the thorn of Srebrenica from the Bosnian Serbs' eastern side. But Mr Oric escaped...." New York Times News Service-07-11-95 2031EDT :.."The commander of the Bosnian Serb army, Gen. Ratko Mladic, said in a letter to Gen. Rupert Smith, the U.N. commander in Bosnia, that the Serbian offensive had been undertaken to žžneutralize'' what he called terrorists in Srebrenica. Mladic accused the United Nations of failing to demilitarize the so-called safe area of Srebrenica. He said civilians and peacekeepers were not endangered by Bosnian Serb military activity. The United Nations has confirmed that the Bosnian government used the safe areas for staging attacks....." Associated Press July 11: ".....Lt. Col. Gary Coward, a U.N. spokesman in Sarajevo, confirmed that Muslim-led government troops had used the "safe area" to make attacks on Serbs surrounding the enclave, but said the raids were not large-scale...." Reuters ZAGREB, Croatia: "...Bosnian Serb leader Radovan Karadzic said the Serbs seized the enclave because Moslem-led government troops were staging what he called "terrorist" attacks out of the area....." June 27, General Ratko Mladic: "....According to him, "UNPROFOR did not carry out its main task nor implement the agreements signed by its generals, from Morilion to Rose. "The protected zones of Srebrenica, Zepa and Gorazde are not demilitarized, while Sarajevo, Tuzla and Bihac were not the subject of talks between the warring sides and they are not defined as protected zones," said Mladic...." The following are quotations from various sources and published articles from the Western press that will explain more in-depth how "demilitarized safe area of Srebrenica" acctualy was: N.Y. Times News Service: GOVERNMENT TROOPS ATTACK BOSNIAN SERB VILLAGE By STEPHEN KINZER 1995: VISNJICA, Bosnia-Herzegovina In a raid before dawn that again illustrated the weakness of U.N. forces here, Bosnian government soldiers apparently slipped past U.N. posts on Monday and attacked this isolated Bosnian Serb village, burning several houses, stealing livestock, and leaving a dozen families homeless, a Bosnian Serb spokesman said. Although the assault had no great military significance, it reflected both the growing frustration of government troops and the inadequacy of U.N. peacekeepers who have pledged to prevent them from leaving supposedly demilitarized enclaves in eastern Bosnia. Visnjica is a miserable settlement perched on a mountainside a few miles from Srebrenica, one of the Muslim towns in eastern Bosnia which the United Nations has designated as demilitarized "protected areas." But Monday's raid was apparently launched by troops based inside Srebrenica, leading Bosnian Serb officers to denounce the United Nations for failing to comply with its promise to keep the town free of soldiers and weapons. "There have been a number of incidents like this in the last 15 to 20 days," said Lt. Col. Milovan Milutinovic, chief spokesman for the Bosnian Serb army. "The Muslim soldiers who carried out this attack crossed lines patrolled by Dutch U.N. troops whose job it is to prevent just this kind of action. We therefore conclude that the U.N. forces are aligning themselves with the Muslim army." Several of the impoverished farmers who live in Visnjica said they had assumed they were safe here because of U.N. pledges. "We thought that no one could attack us from Srebrenica because the town was demilitarized and surrounded by U.N. soldiers," said Ljubomir Vukovic, 67, as he stood in the smoldering ruins of the house he shared with two other families. "But they came from right over that hill." Vukovic pointed toward a peak separating his village from Srebrenica. A U.N. post there is supposed to prevent soldiers from passing in either direction...". But as Monday's raid showed, they are still able to strike fear into the hearts of Serb villagers.Their goal may be to terrorize these villagers into abandoning their homes, thus leaving formerly Serb areas uninhabited...." What kind of living Srebrenica's Muslim commander Oric was providing to refugees in the "safe area" explains the following: "Globe and Mail" July 12, 1995: "....The refugees in Srebrenica, most of them Muslim women and children who fled into Srebrenica ahead of a massive and brutal wave of Bosnian Serb "ethnic cleansing" in eastern Bosnia in the spring of 1993, have been desperate to leave the town ever since they arrived. Instead, they have been forced to remain by the local Muslim warlord, Naser Oric, who drove around town in a Mercedes while the refugees sustained on meagre UN handouts and were, occasionally, sold water by Srebrenica residents during the brutally-hot summers. Mr. Oric and the Bosnian government knew that if the majority of refugees were allowed to be trucked across Serb-held territory to Tuzla or some other viable sanctuary, both the UN protection and any hope of holding on to the remote and surrounded enclave would be lost. The Srebrenica residents treated the refugees atrociously. When the refugees elected a representative to present their demands to Oric, the representative was murdered within hours..." As seen so many times before in Bosnia's civil war, the Bosnian Muslim led government had no scruples and did not hesitate to use the refugees misery in order to gain "International support". At the same time a "courtesy" that BMA treated UN troops with - those very same troops that were feeding the "safe area" for almost three years - could be read in: The Electronic Telegraph Tuesday 11 July 1995 World News: "...Dutch UN peacekeepers formed a barrier of personnel carriers between advancing Serb tanks and Muslim soldiers defending the town. One of the personnel carriers rolled off the road as it manoeuvred after Muslim forces opened up on it with a grenade and small arms. When another carrier tried to pull it back on to the road, a Muslim soldier of the Bosnian army fired an anti-tank rocket at it, but missed..." CHRIS HEDGES .1995 N.Y. Times News Service: "...The captured observation posts came under tank fire, and a peacekeeper was shot dead the 67th to be killed in the conflict by Bosnian government forces as the Dutch troops retreated from the advancing Bosnian Serb forces..." What was going onamong the BMA defenders inside the "safe area" please read from the articles published in the Western press : New York Yimes, July 23, 1995 by Alan Cowell: ..."The Dutch accounts, by soldiers, officers and the Defence Minister, were unanimous in asserting that the Bosnian Muslim soldiers who had been under siege in Srebrenica for three years abandoned the town around two days before it fell. Before the defenders left the town, General Couzy said, Dutch soldiers saw: "in two locations there was fighting between those who wanted to stay and those who wanted to go. Many Dutch soldiers said they had been upset and troubled by the sight of soldiers seeming to abandon their wives and children to the advancing Serbs."... How many of BMA soldiers actually have died from the "friendly fire" it will remain a secret , but the victims are certainly submitted by the Bosnian Muslim led government as "missing civilians killed by the Serbian aggressors". The BSA did not use thousands of troops as it was suggested by the PR companies hired by the Bosnian Muslim led government. As a meter of fact it was published that: The Times, 14 July 1995 Muslim soldiers "failed to defend town from Serbs" By Michael Evans, Defense Correspondent: "...The Muslim defenders of Srebrenica put up only a brief fight against the Serbs, and their commanders left the night before the Serb tanks entered the town, according to Western intelligence sources yesterday. The abandonment of Srebrenica to a relatively small Serb advancing force caused surprise in the West, especially after the largely Muslim government army had demonstrated considerable infantry skills in recent attacks. There were reports that up to 1,500 Serbs were involved in the assault on Srebrenica, but intelligence sources estimated a force of about 200, with five tanks carried out the main attack. "It was a pretty low-level operation, but for some reason which we can't understand the BiH (government) soldiers didn't put up much of a fight," one source said...." "....However, the advance into the town was seen by intelligence assessors as an opportunist move. "I don't think the Serbs had predicted the timing of this operation," one source said. The apparent decision by the Muslims to abandon the town provided the Serbs with a sudden opportunity to occupy Srebrenica, bypassing the Dutch on the road a mile south of the town. The intelligence source said: "The BiH just melted away from Srebrenica and the senior officers left the night before." The source said the Muslim defenders were "adequately armed" for street-fighting..." Loosing (deliberately?) the Srebrenica enclave, the Bosnian Muslim led government started to play the pre-arranged PR campaign with innocent refugees from Srebrenica: The Daily Telegraph, July 15, 1995: "Muslims manipulate refugees' agony: .....The Bosnian government deliberately increased the suffering of the Muslim refugees fleeing Srebrenica to put pressure on the international community, according to the documents made available to the Daily Telegraph. The papers include instructions to the United Nations from the government of Alija Izetbegovic in Sarajevo that the refugees must be taken in their thousands to a single location rather than being spread around the numerous available centers. The resulting television pictures and media reports of chaos among aid workers overwhelmed when the refugees arrived at the UN base in Tuzla were intended to bring about a decisive international response..." Once again victims of the civil war were paying the price for the unspeakable crimes that their - Bosnian Muslim - representatives were orchestrating. As so many times before, killing their own people (bomb massacres in Sarajevo), increasing the suffering of the innocent refugees... nothing was secret to Alija Izetbegovic and his Islamic followers. Then, in order to put more pressure on the UN, Security Council, International Community, they (The Bosnian Muslim Government) came out with "the victims story". The amounts of "massacred" BMA soldiers were going from 1,000 up to 15,000. Without considering the astonishing fact that in the "demilitarized safe area" there were several brigades of BMA troops, let's read the following: Reuters May 29, 1996: "....The six investigators are searching for evidence to convict Bosnian Serbs involved in the massacre of at least 3,000 unarmed Muslim men from Srebrenica, a U.N. declared "safe area" overrun by the Serbs last July. After two hours of digging with shovels, picks, rakes and hoes, investigators allowed reporters to approach the site, where at least four corpses were found...." (Mass graves and the proof of mass killings!) The Times, August 02, 1995 "Missing enclave troops found" by Michael Evans and Michael Kallenbach: "...Thousands of the "missing Bosnian Muslim soldiers from Srebrenica who have been at the centre of reports of possible mass executions by the Serbs, are believed to be safe to the Northeast of Tuzla..... ...For the first time yesterday, however, the Red Cross in Geneva said it heard from sources in Bosnia that up to 2,000 Bosnian Government troops were in area north of Tuzla. They had made their way from Srebrenica "without their families being informed", a spokesman said, adding that it had not been possible to verify the reports because the Bosnian Government refused to allow the Red Cross into the area. Although the Red Cross refused to speculate why the Bosnian Government was keeping secret the presence of the Srebrenica troops near Tuzla, it probably is doing so for military reasons..." New York Times, July 17, 1995 by Chris Hedges: Some 3,000 - 4,000 Bosnian Muslims who were considered by United Nations officials to be missing after the fall of the Srebrenica enclave have made their way through enemy lines to Bosnian Government territory. The BMA troops were ordered to attack the northern flanks of the BSA positions and not to surrender to enemy. It is more that logical to expect that the BSA troops were fighting back at BMA attacks and were not welcoming BMA soldiers with flowers. It is rather ridiculous to expect one army to "greeting" the enemy firing on them with smiles and welcoming words...: Reuters, January 30, 1996: ".....Melvudin Mandzic, 22, released by the Bosnian Serbs on Sunday, told Reuters how he had fled the capture of the U.N. "safe area" of Srebrenica, where thousands of his comrades are believed to have been killed in ambushes and massacres then buried in mass graves. Mandzic's epic escape took him through the wooded hills of Northeast Bosnia, across Serbia where he was captured and sent back to a Bosnian Serb jail, and then finally to freedom in Sarajevo on Sunday. Pale, smoking heavily, Mandzic recalled how commanders of the Muslim-led Bosnian government army on July 11 ordered their 13,000 heavily-outgunned fighters in the area to try to break through Serb forces closing in on Srebrenica...." At the several occasions UN Secretary General Boutros Boutros-Ghali tried to present "charade" performed by the Bosnian Muslim led government to UN Security Council. On May 30, 1995, Secretary general writes (U.N. document S/1995/444) that there never was an enforcement concept behind the žžsafe areas'' six towns surrounded by Serb-held territory. The Security Council did not require the Bosnian Government to withdraw its forces from the areas but muttered about how naughty it would be to carry out attacks against them or from them. On page 18 there is this passage from the Secretary General: "In recent months, government forces have considerably increased their military activity in and around most safe areas, and many of them, including Sarajevo, Tuzla, and Bihac, have been incorporated into the broader military campaign of the government's side."The headquarters and logistics installations of the Fifth Corps of the government army are located in the town of Bihac and those of the second Corps in the town of Tuzla. "The government also maintains a substantial number of troops in Srebrenica (in this case a violation of a demilitarization agreement) Gorazde and Zepa, while Sarajevo is the location of the General Command of the government army and other military installations. There is also an ammunition factory in Gorazde. "The Bosnian Serb forces' reaction to offensives launched by the government army from safe areas have generally been to respond against military targets within those areas, often at a disproportionate level."
  • srebrenica_man - 72759 - 14.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (0)


    Ethnic Conflicts in Civil War in Bosnia -Political manipulation with term of Genocide (2)

    25. Normal War Engagement The conditions that were set by UN SC allowed Muslim forces in Srebrenica enclave to do virtually anything. Under the Muslim Command Unit of 8th Operative Group, 28th Division, consisting of 280, 281, 282, 283, 284, etc., launched the attacks on Serbs villages that had been already attacked during 1992 and 1993. Most of the attacks were terroristic action by a small group of soldiers. More than 500 Serbs were killed by the attack form "Safe Area", and the cruelty of killings were the same as before . Dutch battalion later described this attack as follows. "Operations were relatively unpredictable because the units were almost without training and rather non-disciplined. Muslim forces made systematic assaults from the enclave, and afterwards they used to withdrew to the territory under the protection of UN." It is needless to say UNPROFOR as well as civilians were used as human shields. Military supplies were sufficient in "Safe Area," so that there were almost no problem to continue the offensive. The huge documents which Muslim forces left in Srebrenica delineate each delivery of ammunition, military uniforms, boots, computer equipment, office equipment, cigarettes, etc. Furthermore, even money amounting to 308,850 DEM were transferred to Naser Oric, according to the document from Commander Colonel Avdo Palic (dated Feb 14, 1995). More surprisingly, Muslim forces used even helicopters between Headquarters and Srebrenica or Zepa . A series of documents which were exchanged with Headquarters recorded the helicopter accident of 7 May 1995 at Igrisnik between Zepa and Srebrenica, informing 11 deaths and 9 injuries. Taking an advantage of virtually free traffic, US secretly had communication equipment flown to Tuzla, which would enable Muslim forces to coordinate offensive operations between larger units . Thanks to those conditions of "Safe Area", Muslim forces regained the power enough to attack Bosnian Serbs' vital supply route, being well coordinated with other units. Even one month before the fall of Srebrenica, Muslim forces in "Safe Area" were planning to break the road communication around Vlasenica in cooperation with the units of 2nd corps in Sarajevo. Meanwhile, operation of Republika Srpska forces of Bosnian Serbs were generally directed to keep the status quo and to protect Bosnian Serbs population in Srebrenica area from the attacks of Muslim forces in the enclave, or "Safe Area" . As all Muslim enclaves or "Safe Area" including Srebrenica were less important for Serbs, territory wise, Republika Srpska forces did not care very much about the enclaves as long as Muslim forces refrained from attacking Serbs' village and the Serbs' vital supply route. Moreover, Bosnian Serb forces did not have enough soldiers to take over Srebrenica although they had more heavy weapons, which would become ineffective in the mountainous landscape of Srebrenica. Therefore, even when Muslim forces of Srebrenica faced food crisis in spring 1993, the two Bosnian Serb political leaders, Karadzic and Milosevic, were adamant that there was no intention to take Srebrenica. Although Mladic had not been in good terms with Karadzic in those day by his quasi- coup d'etat against Karadzic, he also answered to Kareeman's question on July 21, 1995, after the fall of Srebrenica, that he would not have thought about attacking the enclaves if Muslim soldiers in "Safe Area," such as Srebrenica, Gorazde, and Zepa had been completely disarmed . In addition, on the fall of Srebrenica, Mladic showed his indifference to the territory itself by asking representatives of Muslim refugees and civilians in Srebrenica whether they would like to stay in Srebrenica or go to Muslim territories or foreign countries. What Bosnian Serb forces wanted from Muslim forces was to stop the assaults against Serbian civilians and their vital supply route. 26. Fall of Srebrenica - Chaotic Muslim Soldiers When Srebrenica began to fall into the hands of Serbs from July 6, 1995, Muslim forces in Srebrenica were hysterical, being in confusion and chaos. Having seen Dutch Battalion of UNPROFOR withdrawing, Muslim forces together with three citizens shot a blue helmet, Sergeant Van Renseen, to death on July 8. On the same day, some Muslim soldiers threw grenade at Dutch Battalion, demanding the Dutch to go towards Bosnian Serb forces and fight. On July 9, Muslim soldiers who did not allow Dutch to withdraw held another Dutch battalion for overnight . On July 10, Muslim troops threatened a Dutch captain with anti-tank weapons not to move although the Dutch captain wanted to move in order to target Bosnian Serb forces more directly . On July 11, Dutch solders saw mutual fighting in various places between Muslim soldiers who wanted to surrender and Muslim soldiers who wanted to continue to fight . On July 12, several Dutch soldiers saw a man hang himself in factory complex opposite of the Dutch base in Potocari. Negotiation With Muslim Civilians & Refugees in Srebrenica Enclave At the fall of Srebrenica, Mladic negotiated with Karremans, Dutch commander, and three representatives of Muslim civilians and refugees three times. Based on the decision of the three representatives including a woman, Mladic organized the evacuation of people, and asked for the help of the three representatives to carry out the evacuation smoothly. What he repeatedly told them was to ask soldiers to give up weapons within 24 hours. He said that Muslim soldiers, including soldiers not in uniform and even war criminals, would be treated according to the Geneva Convention if they hand over their weapons. Muslim Soldiers Who Did Not Surrender The conclusion of this negotiation must have been a nightmare for Muslim forces that were in confusion. Most of the soldiers were occupied with the worst scenario in which Bosnian Serb forces would execute all men. Later, some of the Muslim soldiers who had fled admitted, in various magazines, that the reason they had decided to flee was due to this worst scenario. Besides, Muslim hard liners' pressure was mounting so high that soldiers that had decided to surrender had to expect some assaults from their own fellows . At the night of July 10, the Muslim soldiers who had decided not to surrender started fleeing. According to Dutch Battalion, a group of some 300 soldiers of Muslim forces disappeared in moving toward the west. On the night of July 11-12, between 10,000 and 15,000 men, who had converged on the area of Jaglici and Susnjari, went in the forests to reach Tuzla or Kladanj. Mehrudin Mesanovic said in the local magazine of Sarajevo that brigades gathered in Buljim on July 11 started into woods by platoon and platoon. Although no confirmed figures are available, it is estimated that 10,000-15,000 Muslim soldiers had left Srebrenica through woods according to the Report of the Secretary-General and other accounts . Muslim Who Surrendered Approximately 25,000 out of 40,000 Muslims decided to surrender and gathered in Potocari. According to Dutch battalion, the majority of people were women, children, and the elderly, and the military capable men accounted for only 2% to 3%. Bosnian Serb forces separated them into a group of women, children, and the elderly and a group of military capable men. The purpose of this separation was two-fold: to catch Muslim soldiers as many as possible as war prisoners in order to exchange them for Serbs imprisoned by Muslim Army particularly in Sarajevo, and to screen out Muslims who had committed hideous crimes against Serbian citizens particularly in 1992 and 1993. Being free from allegation of military engagement, a group of women, children, and the elderly were directly transferred to Kladanj, a Muslim territory. On the other hand, a group of men, amounting to about 500 to 750 (or 2%-3% of 25,000), were transferred to Bratunac, where they were screened for the check of war crimes, and were grouped into three; (1) a group of men who did not have any criminal records, (2) a group of men who were required to go through farther check for war crimes, (3) a group of men who were determined to be war criminals. As for (1), Bosnian Serb forces considered the men of this group as civilians but not as prisoners of war. Thus, they were transferred from Bratunac to Kladanj, a Muslim territory, on July 14, immediately after the criminal screening. The fact that the men in this group did not become the targets for the exchange of prisoners was noteworthy because the men in this group might have fought as soldiers. In fact, a Muslim man that had been released as a civilian on this time in Bratunac disappointed Bosnian Serb forces later when he was caught as a prisoner of war on the front line near Sarajevo . The number of Muslim men in this group is estimated to be around 500 because six buses and four trucks are said to be used to transport them . The Muslim men in the remaining two groups became prisoners of war, according to their war activities. As for (2), the group was transferred from the prison of Bratunac to the prison of Batkovic. As for (3), the group was sent from the prison of Bratunac to the prison of Zvornik. The number of Muslim men in these two groups is estimated to be less than 250 in total because the number of men in all three groups totaled 500 to 750, and the group (1) consisted of approximately 500 men. When ICRC visited all three prisons in Bratunac, Batkovic and Zvornik afterwards , it registered 164 persons from Srebrenica at the prison of Batkovic on July 26, 1995 , and noted 193 persons from Srebrenica in total by November 1995 . Later, the majority of the Muslim war prisoners in these groups seems to have been exchanged for the Serbian war prisoners via ICRC. One of the example is Ibran Mustafic, a founder of the ruling Muslim party (SDA) in Srebrenica and Srebrenica representative to Muslim Parliament . He was exchanged for a Serb imprisoned by Muslim Army after having spent nine months in the prison in Batkovic although Mustafic was on the list of war criminals of Bosnian Serbs side . Unfortunately, the number of the persons who were exchanged from the group (2) and (3) is unknown due to the confidentiality of ICRC documents. Yet, taking into consideration the fact that about 500 out of 750 men gathering in Potocari were transferred to Kladanj unconditionally, the remaining 250 must have been very precious war prisoners for Bosnian Serb forces. Other than the above three groups, there was a group of 88 wounded persons . As for the evacuation of this group, ICRC said that 65 of them were transferred to Muslim territories on July 17 and 18 . Although 23 remained, ICRC noted their identities to trace them as war prisoners afterwards . As ICRC's check of identities would secure the lives of the noted persons, almost all wounded persons are considered to be exchanged for Serbian war prisoners later. Other than ICRC report, there were two accounts that contradict each other: the statement of Medicina Sans Frontiers and the statement of Dutch battalions . Taking into consideration that the statement of Medicina Sans Frontiers was also inconsistent with ICRC report and that the statement was given by the locals that Medicina Sans Frontiers employed from the enclave, their statement should not be taken seriously. 27. Alleged Massacre - Fleeing Muslim Soldiers It is said that the dreadful massacre of Muslims occurred at the fall of Srebrenica. Particularly, Muslim soldiers who decided to flee through woods instead of surrendering are said to be executed by Bosnian Serb forces as if they had been hunting rabbits. However, two important facts were ignored in this understanding: those soldiers were carrying weapons in spite of Mladic's repeated warning, and there were ferocious fighting between those Muslim soldiers and Bosnian Serb soldiers. As all Muslim soldiers headed for Muslim territories, Tuzla or Kladanj, through woods, they had to cross roads that cut off the woods vertically from north to south in some points, such as Buljim, Kamenica, Kravica, Pobudje, Nova Kasava, Bajkovica, Crni Vrh, and the line from Konjevic Polje to Milici . The combats were very intense in these places. According to a Muslim survivor, Bosnian Serb forces were waiting along the path which Muslim soldiers had to cross, and did not dare to walk into the woods . As Bosnian Serb forces were carrying anti-aircraft weapons, what they had to do was just to wait and shoot at massive Muslim soldiers coming out of the woods if they do not obey the warning of surrender . Yet, Bosnian Serb forces lost the fight at several places, such as Baljkovica, Krizevac, etc. and suffered the loss of 300 - 500 soldiers because Bosnian Serb soldiers, being inferior in number , could not fight with hundreds or thousands of Muslim soldiers that crossed roads at a time even by heavy artillery. Among the loss of Bosnian Serb forces, there were quite a few elite soldiers, and local newspapers of Serbia often carried sad stories of those soldiers together with their photos in those days . Taking into consideration the huge loss of Bosnian Serb forces under the favorable conditions for them , it can be estimated that Muslim forces must have suffered the loss of nearly 2,000 soldiers from military perspectives. However, it must be noted that this combat might look mass killings to the eye of frightened Muslim soldiers although they carried weapons and shot at Bosnian Serb soldiers randamly . There are some accounts that said that no combats occurred virtually . The reason for these accounts was that the women in the buses heading for Kladanj did not see fighting . However, Mladic told General Smith, on July 19, that he had opened the corridor towards Tuzla for Muslim soldiers who had left the enclave around July 10 and 11. Thus, Bosnian Serb forces did not put up serious opposition . Under these conditions, about 6,000 soldiers were able to reach Zenica through woods, according to UNHCR's announce . As Halilovic confirmed proudly in his book, hence, the 28th Division of Muslim Army in Srebrenica had been reorganized, consisting of 6,000 soldiers that had broke the line of Bosnian Serb forces . Therefore, during the daytime of July 12 and 13, when all buses passed by, there had not been serious combats yet. Otherwise, the buses could not have passed. However, during nights, when Muslim soldiers were moving, there were combats. Most of the local pathways became war sites as well as some places on the main roads that the buses took. Therefore, there must have been shooting sounds, which Dutch soldiers heard particularly during nights, and there must have been dead bodies scattered around the roads as the women in the buses saw during daytime. Accordingly, what the women in the buses said was rational, and it was the evidence of the combats during nights rather than the evidence of the absence of the combats. In addition to the death tolls in the combat, there were a number of Muslim soldiers who lost physical power to continue to flee. Dr. Ilijas Pilav, who succeeded this journey, said that he noticed many drowned men when he crossed the Jadar River . He added that there were mutual shootings because of illusions resulted from exhaustion . Another person said that there must have been lots of people who lost lives after losing sense of directions and going into a circle walk . After the combats, a huge number of dead bodies were scattered around. To walk for almost 20 days in the area which might be full of mines without any food and water under the fear of being shot from any directions was such a trauma that Muslim soldiers sometimes mixed reality with illusions . Having looked at dead bodies under the psychological disturbance, some Muslim soldiers could believe what they imagined. Therefore, it is necessary to confirm witness's accounts by site-inspection. Otherwise, enormously hideous stories, such as 'liver-eating story shown in the review of the indictment against Karadzic and Mladzic, would drive the general psychology to a 'witch-hunting' frenzy. Muslims that were transferred by bus As for the group of women, children, and the elderly, they were transferred to Kladanj, a Muslim territory, by buses on July 12 and 13. According to Muslim women that were transferred from Srebrenica by bus, the Serb bus drivers assured that they would protect the passengers and that nobody would touch them. In fact, there are almost no names of women from Srebrenica in the missing list of ICRC. As for the group of men who were transferred to Kladanj, several persons said that they were transferred to Karakaj in Bosnian Serbs' territory instead of Kladanj in Muslims' territory although others appeared to be transferred directly to Kladanj without troubles. According the Karakaj-massacre witnesses, men were crammed into a school complex and its adjacent sports hall in Karakaj and thousands of men were executed there. However, according to the author's site inspection, there was only one school in Karakaj, which was supposed to accommodate Muslim men. However, it was too small to accommodate them and it did not have any sports halls. Moreover, there were school records showing the presence of students day by day in July and in August. In addition, when the author met two Muslim women that had been living in Mali Zvornik (in Serbia), only about 1 km away from the school across the Drina River, they said that they didn't hear any shooting sounds from 13 July afterwards although they lived within the range that the sounds could reach. They just added that they saw a long column of the buses, carrying many Muslims. Judging from this site-inspection, and considering that Mevludin Oric, one of the witnesses who allegedly saw massacre there, was a nephew of Naser Oric, Commander of Muslim forces in Srebrenica, the story of massacre in Karakaj is very skeptical. Another dubious story is regarding the whereabouts of one of the most important Muslim citizens for Bosnian Serb forces. Nesib Mandzic, a citizen that negotiated with Mladzic as a representative of refugees together with two other civilians, is said to be executed by Bosnian Serb forces and listed as a person who disappeared on July 13. However, he signed the paper with the other representatives to confirm the safe completion of the evacuation on July 16, three days after the alleged disappearance. It can be considered that he might be killed later by Muslim soldiers partly because he was one of the persons that Muslim Army must have hated due to the negotiation with Mladzic and partly because he was a refugee but not a citizen of Srebrenica town. Summary Execution for Personal Revenge Considering that a number of Serbs were killed by Muslim neighbors in a very cruel way in 1992 and 1993, there must have been summary executions for the purpose of personal revenge. According to De Groene Amsterdammer dated March 13, 1996, Serbs were so tense to select war criminals with the lists and photos in their hands when they separated military capable men from women and others. Therefore, very selective executions could happen. Regarding the spots where executions took place, most cases must have been limited to Potocari because a particular individual would rarely see the right person among 15,000 fleeing Muslim soldiers in places other than Potocari. Moreover, any person that became insane with revenge would usually kill his target on the spot, i.e. Potocari, rather than waiting for the appropriate time and place. Direct information, such as Dutch soldiers, was one of the examples of summary executions for personal revenge. For instance, according to a Dutch soldier, a Muslim was pulled out of a crowd of refugees and shot in Potocari on July 13. Another Dutch soldier saw 10 Muslim soldiers led by Bosnian Serb soldiers on July 12, and 9 dead bodies were found around the area where they were seen last in Potocari. Yet, it must be noted that just shooting sounds or collecting people in one spot does not necessarily mean killings as shooting sound could be considered to be a threat or a warning and people could be collected in a place for screening for war crimes. The existence of Mladzic in Potocari can be considered to discourage Serbs to take their wild revenge, taking into consideration the vengeful mind of the relatives of Serbian victims that were massacred in 1992 and 1993. Several old Serbs whom the author met in January of 1998 said that they personally saw how merciless Mladzic whacked Serbs who tried to rob empty houses. It was said that Mladzic was too harsh and strict in discipline to overlook any unlawful behaviors of his soldiers. Although these were the statements of Serbs, it must be remembered that the existence of Mladzic does not necessarily mean the systematic killings and could be the deterrence to revengeful killings. Of course, however, Mladzic, who failed to stop killings perfectly, would be responsible as a superior, and those Serbs who directly committed the crimes should be punished accordingly. Summary Execution of Muslim Soldiers Who Were Captured in Fleeing through Woods It is not difficult to distinguish Muslim soldiers that were executed after being captured from Muslim soldiers that were killed in combat. The location of mass graves holds the key. The two of the three exhumation sites that author visited on May 16 in 1996 showed good examples: Cancari and Glodjansko brdo. Both of them are located in the front line area in Kamenica. Cancari is the small village on the way from Srebrenica toward the north-east, the direction of Muslim territories. The mass grave in Cancari was situated along the two local roads. Behind the mass grave, six families were living at the time of exhumation. Bones were mixed up, and the locations of the bones were not natural. Therefore, ICTY, who was working on this mass grave, presumed that they were moved from somewhere to here in order to hide. However, the circumstances were not so convincing. Firstly, the site was so close to local roads that it was not an appropriate place to hide something. Secondly, if a truck picks up dead bodies who were killed in combats for clean-up, the locations of bones were disarranged anyway. Lastly, according to a ICTY officer, this site was shown by one of the US satellite photos, which could be any graves not necessarily for summarily executed persons. Mass graves does not always mean mass execution. A village man in Cancari area began to grumble to the author about his corns, saying that his corn field was stamped so hard by massive Muslims during nights that he could not harvest corn. According to him, the combats had been so ferocious that bodies of soldiers killed in the combats had scattered around the area, and the whole area had smelled terribly as it had been more than 30 degrees. As domestic animals had eaten some of internal organs of dead human bodies, villagers had to kill all of their domestic animals. Under these circumstances, someone had to pick up the bodies to put into the ground for the sake of hygiene. On the other hand, the mass grave in Glodjansko brdo was located deep in forests. It was the site where someone wanted to hide bodies. This mass grave had been once dug in 1993 by Bosnian Serbs because it had contained victims of Serbian civilians killed in 1993. However, the exhumation work had been suspended due to the fierce combats. Most of local newspapers had carried the exhumation as top stories in those days. Comparing the two sites, it can be concluded that the mass grave in a open space along a road in combat areas were created for hygiene reasons for numerous soldiers killed in the combats. On the other hand, mass graves deep in forests are considered to be the ones which criminals wanted to hide. The exhumation site of ICTY is considered to be one of the examples of mass graves created for hygiene reasons.
    srebrenica_man - 72758 - 14.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (1)


    Ethnic Conflicts in Civil War in Bosnia - Political manipulation with term of Genocide (1)

    Part II (Practical work) Case Study: Srebrenica
  • Role of so called international media's
  • Photo documentations Ignored Massacre of Bosnian Serbs & Alleged Massacre of Muslims 13.The current situation of Srebrenica: Despair of Serbs The town of Srebrenica, which is located at the east of the entity of Bosnian Serbs or Republika Srpska in Bosnia, has the population of approximately 20 thousands now. Eighty percent of the current population is Internally Displaced Persons (IDPs) particularly from Sarajevo in Bosnia and refugees mostly from Krajina in Croatia. Although almost three years have passed since the end of the war in Bosnia, no sign to restore Srebrenica can be seen. Water is still limited in supply, and not suitable for drink. Broken windows and doors make people shivering in winter. The school buildings in the elementary school have disgusting stench of damaged toilets. There are almost no economic activities to hire the population to sustain the life although this area is rich in land and minerals such as lead and zinc. Under these circumstances, refugees or IDPs have to endure the lowest level of the living conditions, and most of them are left alone without any means of income. The local report warned that the rate of suicides and sudden death among the refugees and IDPs was high in Srebrenica area possibly because of the combination of despair and malnutrition. The report continued to say that the year of 1996 particularly saw the high rate of mortality of the refugees and IDPs in the area, citing the deaths of more than 150 IPDs in Bratunac, a relatively large town in the area. Aid, which has recently begun to trickle down into Republika Srpska due to its apparent willingness to cooperate with western countries, carefully avoids Srebrenica area not to make it a beneficiary. The reason is the alleged massacre of Muslims in Srebrenica in 1995. For the countries insisting that the bad guys, Serbs, carried out cruel ethnic cleansing of poor Muslims in Srebrenica area, the emotional conscience is so convincing that they do not want to hurt Muslims by rewarding Serbs, no matter how many refugees and IDPs are living in Srebrenica area. In general, however, emotion is often shaped by temporary hysteria and biased or unconfirmed information. Conscience driven by emotion, thus, tends to be deceived fairness. The case of "alleged Srebrenica massacre" is not an exception. 14. Depressive History of Serbs in Srebrenica: From the majority to the minority Srebrenica has a sad history for Serbs particularly during World War II, and their sorrow is reflected in the number of Serbs population in Srebrenica. Before the World War II, Serbs accounted for 50.6% and Muslims for 49.4% of the total population, or 36,000, in Srebrenica area. However, because of the atrocities of German Nazi's collaborators against Serbs in the area during the war and its resultant low growth of the population afterwards, the ratio of Serbs to the total population, or 80,000, dropped to 35.6%, and the ratio of Muslims increased to 61.9% in 1991, according to the census of the former republic of Bosnia and Hercegovina (BH). 15. Nazi's "SS Handzar Division" and Srebrenica Nazi collaborators in BH, which belonged to Independent State of Croatia, or a puppet state of Fascist Germany, were called "SS Handzar Division" of Ustasha. The Division was established in February 1943, by the order of Hitler and with the blessing of Jerusalem Mufti, Hitler's close associate, in order to fight against Tito's partisans. The role of "SS Handzar Division" was to eradicate Serbs, and it consisted of 20,000 soldiers, mainly Muslims . The techniques of terror that it used were appallingly cruel, being inherited from Turks in the period of Ottoman Empire . According to Florentin Manuel , the most usual techniques were raping women, removing eyes and cutting testicles of alive men, and the action of "SS Handzar" was more like an armed band than a military unit . It is said that their cruelty was such that even German SS officers accused actions of those people . Srebrenica area was under the direct assault of this "SS Handzar Division" during World War II. 16. Alija Izetbegovic (President of Bosnian Muslims) and Srebrenica In the history of Srebrenica, Alija Izetbegovic, the current President of Bosnia and Hercegovina, is the person who connects the present and the World War II. During the World War II, he was a main actor for "SS Handzar Division". He joined the organization "Young Muslims" in Sarajevo on March 5, 1943, and was engaged as a member of the organization in recruiting young Muslims for "SS Handzar Division" in collaboration with Hitler's intelligence service (ABWER and GESTAPO). In 1946, however, he was sentenced by former Yugoslav Supreme Military Court to three years of imprisonment and two years of deprivation of civil rights, because of his fascist activities . This criminal record of Izetbegovic was published by Russian gazette "Izvestija" dated 17 November of 1992. "Islamic Declaration" was another criminal record of Izetbegovic. Having shown his fundamentalism or intolerance of other religions ", he was sentenced to twelve years imprisonment by Supreme Court of Bosnia on March 14, 1983. However, in spite of the prohibition of its publication, "Islamic Declaration" was reprinted in 1990. Two years later, it seemed that he began to resume the activities of "SS Handzar" based on his Islamic fundamentalism particularly in Srebrenica area, intentionally or unintentionally. 17. Srebrenica area: Strategic Importance for Muslims Creation of Cordon (Geographical Center of Islam) According to Muslim National Council established on the eve of Bajram (the end of February) in 1992, the goal of all radical Muslims led by Izetbegovic was to create the Islamic State within the borders of BH . The largest concern to achieve this goal was the geographical and ethnical closeness between eastern Bosnia and Serbia in Yugoslavia. Taking into the consideration the fact that south eastern Bosnia already had demographic and Islamic connection to Sandzak and Kosovo in Serbia, the serious problem lay in 'north eastern Bosnia', where Srebrenica area stretched over. Therefore, there was an urgent necessity to draw a cordon between Serbs in eastern Bosnia and Serbs in Serbia . Under these circumstances, a huge number of invitations to the gathering in Bratunac in Srebrenica area were distributed among Muslims throughout Bosnia at the beginning of 1992, and the large gathering was held in Bratunac on the first day of Bajram, the celebration to end Ramadan, in the presence of Izetbegovic. There, Bratunac was proclaimed 'Geographic center of Muslim for the whole (former) Yugoslavia,' and to arm Muslims was openly declared. 18. Mutual Fear In the middle of the radical Islamic and militant activities, however, the general Muslim citizens in Srebrenica area were afraid of this abrupt militant move in their area in the same way that Serbs were frightened. As Besim Ibisevic (Muslim), former President of Township Assembly in Srebrenica, told a local magazine in Sarajevo, the general Muslim citizens had shouted 'peace at any cost' in the big crowded hall of culture club in Srebrenica in April 1992 . People in Srebrenica, therefore, did not allow Muslim extremists, such as Naser Oric and Zulfo Tursunovic, to enter the Srebrenica area at the beginning. According to the confession of Naser himself, he had to hide in forests together with his fellows, and get food secretly . Behind the scene, however, rifles and uniforms had been already sent to every township assembly and SDA (or Muslims') party . In addition, Vox, radical Muslim magazine in Sarajevo, published the name of Serbs to be killed in Srebrenica to threaten Serbs under the excuse of 'War Criminals' who fought as Tito's partisans against "SS Handzar". Only a little provocative push was necessary to drive people to conflicts. At the end of 1991, when Muslim National Council was on the last stage to prepare insurgence against the Former Yugoslavia, Izetbegovic and his followers decided to depend on criminals' power. For Srebrenica, they found Naser Oric and Zulfo Tursunovic as the persons whom they could depend on. Naser, born in Srebrenica area, was a policeman in Beograd in Serbia, and worked as one of the bodyguards of Milosevic, the current President of Yugoslavia. However, when Oric was fired for theft in the end of 1991, Izetbegovic's group picked him up, and appointed him as the Commander of Territorial Defense for Srebrenica. Meanwhile, Zulfo Tursunovic was in the jail in Zenica in 1991 because he had killed three Muslims in 1986. Although he did not finish the service of 15 year-imprisonment, Izetobegovic ordered the release of Zulfo, and appointed him as Deputy Dommander of BH Army in Srebrenica at the end of 1991. In the beginning of 1992, Naser and Zulfo got together in order to sneak into Srebrenica. They hid in the woods, and succeeded to sneak into Srebrenica in spring 1992. 19. Start of Ethnic Cleansing of Serbs Mutual distrust and fear between Serbs and Muslims were mounting high in Srebrenica. Armed Muslim gangs among which the Patriot League was formed in Vlasenica near Srebrenica area started raising mutual fear among people from April 1992 . Serbs already began to be fired from governments, police, schools, health institutions, and business. A group of Muslim locals in the disguise of Arkan soldiers, a Serbian para-military group, came to Srebrenica area and raised the fear in Muslim civilians ". Then, on May 8 1992, Judge Goran Zekic, President of SDS (Bosnian Serbs' political party) in Srebrenica area and Bosnian Serb representative of Srebrenica to BH Parliament was ambushed and killed. A mass exodus of Serbs from Srebrenica town to Bratunac started immediately . Ethnic Cleansing of Serbs Reliance on Serbs' Supply and Cleansing of Serbs According to Sefer Halilovic, former Chief of Staff of BH Army, Muslim's military strategy for Srebrenica area was the total dependence on the Serbs' supplies and properties . He continued to say "The only source of our supply was chetnik's (Serbs') stores and their production." In other words, it was nothing more than the robbery of bandit groups. Muslims started their assault against the smallest Serbian hamlets and then against the villages where Serbs are minority. Afterwards, they targeted Serbs villages surrounded by Muslim villages. Finally, large Serbs villages were targeted. On May 6, 1992, just two days before Zekic was killed, small hamlets, Bljeceva and Gniona, had been already robbed and burnt as a sign indicating what would happen from now on. On May 7, seven Serbs who tried to escape from Srebrenica were ambushed and killed. On May 15, the villages of Viogor, Orahovica, Karno, Civevci, and Radossevi were attacked. In this way, from May 1992 to Jan 1994, as many as 192 villages were robbed and burnt . During the period, 8,000 Serbian houses had been assaulted, and 5,400 houses were completely demolished into rubbles . The number of the killed were more than 1,000, including women, children, and the elderly, and 90% of those were killed particularly during the first six months from May 1992 in spite of the fact that most of them were civilians . 20. Cruelty of violent ethnic cleansing The wild cruelty of Muslim soldiers in Srebrenica area was very similar to the techniques of "SS Handzar" in the period of World War II. Rather than using bullets, Muslim soldiers used dull objects as weapons and gradually killed Serbs, mostly civilians, by mutilating, taking off an eye, castrating, crucifying, or burning. The traces of the torture were so visible on corpses that most of the autopsy process was videotaped and photographed by Serb doctors who conducted autopsy . Meanwhile, the top Muslim commander in Srebrenica, Naser Oric, who orchestrated the attacks together with Zulfo Tursunovic, also videotaped the scene as trophies of war. Washington Post dated February 16, 1994 said: "Burnt Serb houses, headless Serb men, their bodies crumpled in a pathetic heap" was on a videocassette tape. In the article, Naser said, "We had to use cold weapons that night," and explained as scenes of dead men sliced by knives roll over his 21-inch Sony. As Muslim soldiers did not carry this kind of tapes with them in fleeing, Commission of Legal Experts of Republika Srpska kept most of them as evidences. Documents which Muslim soldiers did not have time to take with them in fleeing Srebrenica revealed hideous crimes committed under the order of Naser Oric. One of the Muslim forces" report of No. 06-08/95 explained about the death of a Serb, Milko Markovic, who remained in the town of Srebrenica even after the death of Judge Zekic, as follows; "Milko Markovic was arrested, and delivered to Mis. Mis maltreated him, stung him by knife, and cut his throat. However, because Milko was still alive, Mis brought Milko to a small stream, and tortured him again. As Milko lost consciousness, Mis awoke Milko by pouring water on him. Then Mis burned him alive." It is said that Mis is living in Tuzla now without any troubles. There were some Serbs who received an illogical notice on the death of their families from Muslim authorities. For instance, the daughter of Radovan Marinkovic received the death notice of her father through ICRC (International Committee of Red Cross) on September 24, 1992. The notice with the signature of Zulfo Tursunovic said that her father was killed as a Serb soldier in front of his house. However, her father was too old in fact to be a soldier, and it is weird for any soldier to caryy out military actions in front of his house. It is a mystery why the international media and society hardly paid attention to this savage behavior although a series of attacks were so evident that even a local Muslim citizen explained to the author without any hesitation. More strangely, Prof. Cherif Bassiouni, Chairman of the Commission of Experts, avoided to mention the Muslims' attacks on Srebrenica in Final Report , and submitted it to Security Council through Secretary-General on May 27, 1994. It should be noted that Dragomir Djokic, then Yugoslav Charge d'affaires to UN, had submitted the criminal report and relevant evidences on the Muslims' attacks on Srebrenica to General Assembly of Security Council in June 93, and that the Dr. Stankovic, a world-famous doctor of forensic medicine who had implemented most of the autopsies for the Serbs victims in Srebrenica in 1993, had directly handed over the same report and evidences to Bassiouni. As the report became a basis for the indictments of war criminals in the territory of former Yugoslavia later, those criminals evaded accusations, and they are still free to do anything. The responsibility of Prof. Bassiouni is enormous if they repeat crimes of this kind particularly because he intentionally avoided accusing those criminals. 21. Absence of Bosnian Serb Forces From 1992 to Janary 1993, Bosnian Serb citizens in Srebrenica area were at the mercy of Muslim forces. What Bosnian Serb citizens did was to defend themselves individually by the old weapons that they could find in the house, and wait for the Former Yugoslav Army to help them. However, it never came. In 1992, the Former Yugoslav Army (FYA) was in confusion to see former Yugoslav republics receive the recognition of independence from international society. Although FYA had been in Bosnia since the birth of the Former Yugoslavia, FYA was suddenly left alone in the territory of the enemy after the independence of Bosnia April 1992. One after another Muslim and Croat soldiers deserted the Army. At the decision of the withdrawal from Bosnia in May 4, 1992, FYA started to withdraw and completely withdrew from Bosnia by May 15, 1992, leaving Bosnian Serbs behind. Meanwhile, Bosnian Serb citizens, accounting more than 30% of the Bosnian population, completely relied on the arrival of FYA. Their trust in FYA was so firm that they couldn't believe the withdrawal of FYA. In other words, they didn't understand the seriousness of the situation, particularly in countryside. Thus, they failed to organize self-defense in the absence of leadership. In Srebrenica area, even after the killing of Judge Zekic, Bosnian Serb citizens just waited for the arrival of FYA without taking any all-out defense measures. In order to fill the absence of FYA, Repulika Srpska Army was set up in May 12, 1992. Serb FYA soldiers of Bosnian origin joined Republika Srpska Army after quitting the job in FYA. Being concerned about Bosnian Serb citizens, FYA left the weapons for Republika Srpska Army. However, as the formation of Republika Srpska Army was not well-planned and make-shift in nature due to the sudden withdrawal of FYA, Republika Srpska Army was not able to take effective action in an organized way until the autumn of 1992. Even after the autumn, Republika Srpska Army, being inferior in number to Muslim Army, had to narrow down the area in which they could be totally engaged. As Bosnian Serb civilians in western Bosnia were severely assaulted by Croat Army, Republika Srpska Army focused on west, and it could not defend Bosnian Serb civilians in east Bosnia. It was Janyary 7 of 1993 when Bosnian Serb citizens finally realized that they had to organize themseves to defend. 'Drina Corps' was created in Srebrenica area under the direction of Mladzic. Having looked at fire on their houses, Several Serbs of Bosnian origin joined 'Drina Corps' after quitting FYA's 'Drina Corps,' which was stationed in Serbia. However, FYA's 'Drina Corps' never moved to Srebrenica area, and never directed their weapons at Srebrenica area across Drina River from Serbia. Serbs paramilitary forces were not in Srebrenica from the beginning of the war to the end of the war although there are some reports on Serbs paramilitary forces in Srebrenica. According to the report of UN , for example, "Drina Wolves, Seselj Militia, Specialna Policia, White Eagles, Arkan Tigers and Krajina Serbs" were said to be seen in the area. However, "Seselj Militia" was a regular unit of Republika Srpska Army as Karadzic prohibited paramilitary groups and ordered them at the end of 1992 to join the regular Republika Srpska Army in order to put them under control. "Drina Wolves" was the name of a regular unit of Republika Srpska from the beginning. There were no "Specialna Policia" except Military Police of Republika Srpska. "White Eagles", comprising of only about 50 members, never approached to eastern Bosnia. Neither did "Arkan Tigers." "Krajina Serbs" did not have any energy to defend places other than Krajina in Croatia. 22. Large Territorial Gain and Limitation By pursuing the savage policy of fighting, Muslim forces acquired as much as 95% of Srebrenica area by the end of December 1992. Sefer Halilovic boasted of the expansion of the territory in his book, saying that Srebrenica and Zepa had become an unrealized dream for alive and dead chetniks (Serbs) in spring 1993 . However, serious problems began to change the course of the war from the spring of 1993. The most important problem was lack of food. Having faced the vast territory stretching 70 miles (approx.113km), from the village of Zepa in the south to Kamenica in the north by the end of January 1993, Muslims did not have any more Serbs villages to attack in order to obtain food. A huge amount of food that Muslim forces had taken from Serbs was consumed up by the end of the spring in 1993, and the shortage of food became evident. The second problem was the encirclement of Srebrenica. Geographically, Srebrenica town had been surrounded by villages that had the relatively large Serbs population. Since the Muslims' drive to mop up Serbs was initiated from the inside of Srebrenica town, Serbs were simply pushed outwards and Muslims were drown closer into the center in exchange. Therefore, although the encircled territory of Muslims grew and expanded outwards, the position of Muslims remained unchanged, being encircled by Serbs. The last problem was the start of the offensives of Bosnian Serb forces. As Drina corps of Republika Srpska Army was eventually created in January 1993 , more effective and systematic strategy began to be implemented. Muslim forces were required to take some urgent measures. 23. Safe Area - Srebrenica as a temporary base of Muslim attack Under the plan of Muslim leaders, Muslims' territories in Srebrenica, Zepa, and Gorazde were supposed to grow endlessly until the three areas would merge into a huge chunk connecting central and north eastern Bosnia and create a huge cordon between Muslim state and Serbia in Yugoslavia. When Muslims' territory in Srebrenica area hit the ceiling of expansion, however, this plan collapsed, and the role of Srebrenica changed. Now, they were just like isolated islands in the enemy's sea, waiting for the control of the enemy. However, they could be temporary bases for Muslim forces to attack Serbs until the enclaves would come into the hands of Bosnian Serb forces. Particularly, the location of Srebrenica was best suited to break the Bosnian Serbs' vital supply route (Sarajevo-Vlasenica-Milici-Konjevic Polje -Zvornik) for Sarajevo. Therefore, while knowing that no enclave can last long, Muslim leaders wanted to keep Srebrenica as the base as long as possible. Later, on September 22, 1994, Izetbegovic admitted to a senior UN official that Srebrenica was 'indefensible.' 24. Involvement of UN What Muslim leaders came up with a device to prolong the life of Srebrenica was to use their own civilians and UN to their advantage. Having known that international organizations would bring relief supplies to the civilians, Muslim leaders have decided to keep civilians in the enclave in order that Muslim forces could obtain food and other supplies. In fact, at the end of November in 1992, UNHCR already dispatched the convoy of relief supplies to Muslims in Srebrenica area partly because Srebrenica area became an enclave encircled by Serbs who had been actually pushed outwards by Muslim forces of Srebrenica, and partly because the shortage of food became a serious problem. Being helped by this relief supplies, Muslim forces of Srebrenica launched large-scale attacks on Serbs villages along the Drina River, such as Loznica, Bijelovac, and Sikiric, two weeks later. A number of evidences that belong to Commission of Legal Experts to Republika Srpska easily prove that Muslim forces considered civilians as a magnet to attract relief food from international organizations. One of the proofs is 'demonstration of citizens.' A large group of civilians complained about too small rations of wheat flour, and protested against the Muslim authorities of Srebrenica on May 21, 1993 although UNHCR had sent wheat flour more than the required amount. A Muslim woman that spent years in the enclave of Srebrenica also complained in the author's interview that a half of the vehicles carrying humanitarian aid had been usually empty. Meanwhile, Ibran Mustafic, a founder of SDA (Muslim's political party) of Srebrenica and representative to Muslim BH Parliament, explained about the abundance of supplies as follows; "It was always possible to buy at the market anything one might have wanted. Hardly anything was lacking. Still the only source of goods was humanitarian aid since not a single commercial convoy had ever reached Srebrenica." In order to solve the problem, International aid agencies suggested that the refugees should elect their own representative for the distribution of food. However, the man elected was killed the day after his election. As Dutch battalion said in "Srebrenica: Record of a war crime", Naser Oric , top commander in Srebrenica, and his fellows such as Zulfo Tursunovic and Hakija Meholjic, were nothing more than gangsters who took most of relief supplies from refugee population for his personal profit . Human shield was the other way of using civilians. When UN decided to evacuate 15,000 people at the end of March and at the beginning of April in 1993, the Muslim commanders were furious about the idea, by insisting that UN operation was tantamount to 'ethnic cleansing' and decided that the convoy should not be allowed to come in Tuzla, Muslim territory. Later, however, the Muslim commanders privately confided to a reporter of Independent the real reason: Serbs could not launch an all-out attacks as long as civilians and refugees were there . Muslim forces' attitude towards their own civilians or refugees was merciless particularly when Srebrenica was about to fall under Bosnian Serb forces in July 1995. During the night of July 10 and 11, 1995, people started leaving Srebrenica town and headed for Potocari because of the combat. UNPROFOR decided to help transfer those people to Potocari. However, Muslim soldiers and Mayor of Srebrenica turned those people back , thinking that civilians would become shields from Bosnian Serb forces and hoping for the direct involvement of UN who was supposed to protect civilians. When Muslim leaders were looking for a more effective device to prolong the life of Srebrenica, the international society gave the most ideal scheme for Muslim leaders partly out of the egoistic national interests and partly out of the emotional outrage against Bosnian Serbs offensive called "aggression" and "ethnic cleansing". The scheme which international society offered was the half-hearted setup of "Safe Area", a product of each country's compromise. The most terrible compromise was Paragraph 5 of UN Security Council Resolution 836, which allowed Bosnian forces to stay in "Safe Area" together with civilians . Moreover, although "Safe Area" was supposed to be demilitarized, UNPROFOR were asked not to pursue the demilitarization so actively . Immediately after signing the agreement of cease-fire and demilitarization of Srebrenica and Zepa with Mladic (Supreme military commander of Republika Srpska), Halilovic (Supreme military commander of Muslim Bosnian Army), sent the order to both enclaves that weapons should not be delivered . He explained to Naser Oric that Muslim forces should hand over only unusable arms . In this way, UN, which was supposed to be an impartial institution, allowed Muslim forces to stay with civilians, attack Serbs from the enclave and secure food under the protection of UNPROFOR,. It was the best environments for Muslim forces that wanted to break the Bosnian Serbs' vital supply line rather than to expand the enclave and it was the worst environment for Muslim citizens who did not want to be trapped in the combats. Ibran Mustafic criticized this strategy of Muslim government later, saying that the person who had issued the order should bring his family to Srebrenica before the implementation.
  • kanada - 72756 - 14.08.2012 : Armin Ottawa - best (0)

    U Kanadi sam


    Pozdrav,

    evo ja sam trenutno u Kanadi tj. Ottawi dosao sam tu na HR putovnicu jer ne treba viza za ulazak tražim posao vozača ali nikako da naleti prava firma. Kome god se obratim kada sazna da nemam radnu dozvolu neće dalje da priča. Prije nego sam došao ovamo u više navrata sam čitao o tome kako ima dosta transportnih firmi koje će te primiti i sredidi work permit, ali nije tako, ako neko zna neku prevoznicku firmu da prima strane radnike molim javi te mi moj tel. je 613-240-7767. Hvala unapred.

    Armine,

    ja sam već puno puta napisao da ni jedna ozbiljnija firma u Kanadi neće primiti radnika bez dozvole za rad. Ovo je zbog ogromnih kazni koje se plaćaju za ilegalne radnike. Kanada nije Amerika, tamo je sasvim druga priča.

    Doduše, i u Kanadi imaš poslova koji se rade na crno: čuvanje djece, raznošenje pice... Ima dosta malih biznisa koji zapošljavaju radnike na crno, ali se o tome mnogo ne priča...

    Tvoja jedina šansa da radiš na crno je kod malih firmi, ali ne kao vozač jer u slučaju udesa ta firma bi imala problema sa osiguranjem.
    australija - 72752 - 14.08.2012 : Biljana Bojanic Kraljevo - best (0)

    Iseljenje u Australiju


    Poštovani,

    pročitala sam sve vaše poruke i savete i prvo bih htela da vam se zahvalim na strpljenju i savetima koje pružate svima nama koji bi želeli da živimo bolje.

    Ja sam diplomirani profesor srpskog jezika i knjizevnosti. Imam 34 godine i deset godina staža. Suprug je završio ekonomski fakultet u Beogradu i radio je pet godina kao komercijalni rukovodilac u jednom ovdašnjem preduzeću.

    Imamo dve ćerke, od osam i pet gdina. Ja radim u osnovnoj školi, suprug trenutno ne. Za nas mogu da kažem da smo radni i snalažljivi, jer smo krenuli ni od čega i napravili kuću koja po proceni vredi oko 150.ooo evra.

    Želeli bi da se porodicno iselimo u AU, pa vas molim da nas posavetujete koji bi najbolji način bio za to. Svesni smo činjenice da ne bismo mogli da radimo u našim strukama, pa smo spremni i da se tamo doškolujemo. Iako bi tamo krenuli iz početka, ne bi nam bilo teško, samo da našoj deci bude bolje, jer se ovde život sveo na puko preživljavanje. Znanje jezika bi nam na lestvici od 1-5, ocenila trojkom. Imamo tu kucu koju bi prodali i koja bi nam omogucila da se lakše tamo snađemo. Unapred zahvalni Bojanici iz Kraljeva.

    Biljana,

    ne vjerujem ja da se vi ne bi dobro snašli u Australiji, ali je problem dobiti vizu. Što se vas tiče - sve je problem: ti i suprug ste na starosnoj granici (on je možda i stariji od tebe), vaše znanje jezika nije zadovoljavajuće, nemate pravu struku za Australiju...

    Iskreno rečeno, nemate gotovo nikakve šanse da dobijete vizu. Ipak, vrijedi pokušati, možda vam se posreći.

    Bilo mi je zadovoljstvo čitati tvoj tekst, jer se odmah vidi da si u srpskom mnogo pismenija od ostalih. Za tvoju informaciju - većinu tekstova ispravljam jer su ispod svakog kriterijuma za objavljivanje na ovoj stranici...

    P.S. Ljetos sam boravio nekoliko dana u Kraljevu. To je izuzetno lijep grad i rado bih se sa vama mjenjao. Moje rođene sestre muž je iz Kraljeva, ima kuću kod kasarne.
    odgovor - 72750 - 14.08.2012 : Delija Zvornik - best (2)

    Srebrenica


    Ne znam zašto se više smaramo pišući o toj prokletoj Srebrenici? Dokle više da lupamo glavom o zid i pišemo jednu te iste stvari kako i zašto i koliko je osoba tamo nastradalo? Dokle više da pričamo jednu te istu priču kad nas niko ne sluša ili tačnije ne želi da sluša?

    Mi Srbi dobro znamo šta je istina i za šta je poslužila Srebrenica bjelosvjetskim aždajama. Možemo dokazivati Bogu Ocu na hiljade načina ali ćemo ipak u svijetu ostati genocidan narod jer kako kaže ona narodna "kadija te tuži, kadija ti sudi". Možda nekada u dalekoj budućnosti istina i izađe na vidjelo u šta čisto sumnjam, ali samo je sigurno to da je Srebrenica bila "šlag na torti" u satanizovanju srpskog roda i poroda. Namjerno kažem i poroda jer će i mnoge naše buduće generacije nositi tesko breme srpskog soja.

    I šta sada da radimo? Boriti se protiv anglo-saksonske propagandne mašinerije se ne može, a koji je njen učinak i koliko je moćna osjetili smo na svojoj koži. Ona je jedan prastari narod je načinila genocidnim, rušilačkim i u svijetu omraženim a nacinila je jednu novu naciju "Bosnjake" čistu, lijepu, i nevinu kao Sunce. Za samo četri godine srušila autoritet koji je srpski narod vijekovima gradio. Uništila je sve vrijednosti jednog časnog, poštenog, hrabrog i nadasve odvažnog roda, koji je svojom krvlju zaljevao svaki trenutak svoje teško stečene slobode.

    Ali neka im bude, ja samo molim Boga da nam podari par vijekova mira, da konačno koja generacija mirno proživi a da ne prođe kroz sve one strahota rata jer mi se ipak čini da se odigralo samo jedno poluvrijeme, a kad će početi drugo veliko je pitanje...

    RE: Srebrenica

    Poštovani,

    kao prvo, moram da napomenem da si me pomalo razočarao sa svojim, dosta pesimističkim, komentarom.

    Za mene, kao Srbina, postoje samo dvije svete stvari: sloboda i istina. Za slobodu se boriš u ratu, za istinu u miru. U ratu sam se borio najbolje što sam znao, a u miru sam pokrenuo ovu stranicu jer nisam mogao ništa bolje da smislim.

    U početku sam vjerovao da ova moja borba treba da bude usmjerena na Zapad i englesko govorno područje, pa sam nakon nekog vremena odlučio da se posvetim "suprotnoj strani". Na kraju sam shvatio gorku istinu da nisu svi Srbi podjednako obrazovani po tom pitanju, poput mene i tebe, pa sam ipak odlučio da ovu borbu posvetim našem vlastitom obrazovanju.

    Primjera radi, Boris Tadić, nekadašnji predsjednik Republike Srbije, je pravi laik za Srebrenicu. Jer kako drugačije možeš objasniti njegove komentare i postupke po tom pitanju. Ista stvar važi i za većinu srpskog naroda sa one strane Drine.

    Suština svake propagande, bilo da se boriš za istinu ili laži, je u ponavljanju. Svaki odjek istine je još jedna šansa da neki laik, a u našem narodu ima previše takvih, čuje naš glas i možda nešto i nauči.

    Nisi u pravu ni u vezi tvoje tvrdnje da i ti sve znaš. Sebe smatram dobrim poznavaocem slučaja Srebrenica, ali sam ovaj članak koji su napisali Karganović i Pavić, do sada pročitao tri puta i svaki put sam iz njega naučio nešto novo.

    Razlika između laika i eksperta je vrlo mala, ali bitna. Laik zna istinu ali nema potrebe da je dokazuje. Sa druge strane, ekspert rasploaže sa dokumentima i svjedocima, barata sa argumentima i brojkama, pa svoje stavove uvijek može da dokaže - i laiku i ekspertu.

    I na kraju, nemoj molim te da se ljutiš na ovakvom odgovoru. Prije svega, on nije upućen samo tebi već i svima onima koji misle da znaju sve o Srebrenici. Ukoliko misliš da ti je neka tematika dobro poznata, ti jednostavno preskoči taj članak. Vjerujem da će neki drugi za njega pomisliti da je zlata vrijedan, jer tekstovi poput ovog zadnjeg su dovoljno jaki da i slijepima povrate vid.

    Možda si primjetio da sam u poslednje vrijeme počeo o Srebrenici da pišem i na engleskom. Objavljujem činjenice, spiskove. Nije mi namjera da promjenim svijet, opismenim Zapad. Međutim, moj cilj će biti ostvaren ako samo jedna osoba otvorenog uma pročita moje tekstove - pod uslovom da se to radi o nekom poznatom stranom novinaru.

    Srpski narod ima uzrečicu: "Ko visoko leti, nisko pada". Moje lično mišljenje je da će jednog dana na Zapadu duvati drugačiji vjetorvi i da će istina kad-tad izaći na vidjelo. A biće to pad sa mnogo, mnogo prašine...

    Evo ti i nekoliko engleskih izreka o lažima:

    With truth you're able to grow and build upon it. Anything built on lies will eventually crumble and fall.

    Sa istinom si u stanju da se razvijaš i dograđuješ. Sve što je stvoreno na lažima će jednog dana da se sruši i razbije.

    Wonders what goes through some peoples small minds do you really think you can hide shit forever.

    Pitam se šta prolazi kroz glave onih malih ljudi koji misle da laži mogu da sakriju zauvjek.

    The worst lies are the lies we tell ourselves. We live in denial of what we do, even what we think. We do this because we're afraid. č Richard Bach

    Ričard Bač: Najgore laži su one koje govorimo sami sebi. Živimo u poricanju onoga što radimo, šta mislimo. Radimo to jer se bojimo nečega.
    australija - 72747 - 14.08.2012 : Petar Kragujevac - best (0)

    Viza preko firme u Sloveniji


    Poštovani,

    interesuje me da li postoje šansa za dobijanje neke radne vize u Australiji ako ja posedujem firmu u Sloveniji i preko nje apliciram. Ako postoji, šta je to što bi mi pomoglo da dobijem? Imam 26 godina, 6 godina radnog iskustva u Srbiji. Problem je što sam bio prijavljen samo 2 godine. Po struci sam elektrotehničar za audio i video opremu, ali sam radio poslove iz komercijale i marketinga.

    Hvala unapred! Pozdrav!

    Petre,

    nije mi jasno kako će ti tvoja firma u Sloveniji pomoći da dobiješ vizu? Njih interesuje tvoje radno iskustvo, znenje jezika, godine...
    australija - 72744 - 14.08.2012 : Veljko Rogatica - best (0)

    Poslodavac


    Dragi Željko,

    veĆ sam jednom pisao i vi ste mi puno pomogli međutim situacija se promjenila i sada imam novo pitanje.

    Našao sam poslodavca u Australiji koji Će da garantuje posao meni i adekvatnu platu koju traži država. Zanima me koji je proces oko tih papira koje on treba da završi i šta ja treba da uradim sa ove strane, gdje on da šalje te papire kada završi meni ili da ih preda negdije u Australiu.

    Unapred hvala!

    Veljko,

    odmah da ti kažem, zbog velikih slova, kojima si kucao - umalo da izbrišem tvoju poruku. Međutim, spasilo te ono "Rogatica"....

    Ja stvarno ne znam detalje oko toga, ali znam da je moj prijatelj (poslodavac) morao da angažuje advokata u Beogradu i da je papire sređivao kod vas. Velika je razlika da li ti treba "temporary work visa" ili hoćeš da emigriraš (permanent viza). Ovu drugu je mnogo teže dobiti dok za ovu prvu moraš da imaš samo 4.5 na IELTS testu. Ovo ti govorim zbog toga što ne znam kakvo je tvoje znanje jezika, a treba da znaš i da australijski "permanent visa" možeš dobiti i za vrijeme dok si u Australiji - što je lakše nego iz bivše Juge.
    australija - 72742 - 14.08.2012 : Ruzica Marcic Beograd - best (0)

    Disability Pension Overseas


    Moje poštovanje,

    Molim vas ako mi možete pomoći sa savjetom. Otišla sam sa porodicom u Australiju 97 god dobila državljanstvo redovno i boravila tamo do 2008 . Zbog zdrastvenih razloga nisam mogla više tamo da ostanem vratila sam se za Bgd. I tu sam boravim 4 godine.

    Tamo sam radila nesto ali sam imala i disability penziju jer sam bila psihički u veoma lošem stanju. Međutim moj suprug je dosta zaradivao i oni su mi po zakonu to ukinuli... Tada sam nastavila da radim nekoliko mjeseci i nisam mogla više pa sam odlučila da se vratim u Srbiju.

    U međuvremenu sam se i razvela i ima godinu dana kako živim sama i nemam nikakvo primanje ovdje a ni posao ne mogu dobiti.

    Idem u AUSTRALIJU 31 AUGUSTA pa vas molim da mi kažete kome da se obratim imam li ja pravo da povratim tu moju disability pensioner nemam namjeru ostati u Australiji već se vratiti ovdje i živjeti uz pomoc cerke. Da li ja mogu to da tražim u centrilniku i koja su mi prava a da tu neku pomoć koju bih dobila prenesem ovamo.

    Toplo vam se zahvaljujem u nadi za odgovor!

    Ružice,

    ukoliko želiš da u Australiji ponovo ostvariš pravo na disability penziju, ponesi sve papire koji potvrđuju da si imala istu, kao i potvrdu da si rezvedena (naravno prevedenu kod ovlaštenog prevodioca).

    Uz sve ovo, penziju ćeš relativno lako ostvariti. Možda ćeš morati da ideš na preglede, ali to je normalno. Za odsustvo iz zemlje navedi da je to bila volja tvoga muža, a i bolje si se osjećala u društvu šire porodice.

    Što se ostvarivanja penzije tiče u Srbiji, moraćeš da provjeriš tamo i oni će ti reći koja su važeća pravila. Ja sam na Google pronašao, tako što sam kucao "Australian Disability Support Pension Overseas", da je Australija imala pravilo da si morala da se vratiš u zemlju svakih 26 sedmica, pa su to 2003 smanjili na 7 sedmica. Više ne znam koje je nanovije pravilo.

    Primjera radi, u Kanadi važi pravilo da, ukoliko si u toj zemlji boravio 20 godina, možeš da ostvariš punu penziju bez obzira gdje u svijetu živiš.

    Tvoj slučaj je pomalo specifičan, pa ne znam tačno, a nisam spreman da to dalje istražujem. Moj savjet je - imaš sve na internetu ukoliko znaš engleski.
    zaboravljeni - 72740 - 14.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (1)

    Žene borci VRS


    Predložio bih otvaranje nove teme, koja bi takođe služila nezaboravu. Ovde mislim na temu o srpskim vučicama, ženama borcima, posebno o onim koje su rat proveli na liniji! One koje su imale đulad, kada su mnogi muški prišivali smokvu. Da se zna i da se pamti! Žene kao pokojna Lizdekova, kao Mila Tomić...
    treskavica - 72738 - 14.08.2012 : Treskavica Istocna Foča - best (0)

    Treskavica


    Prije dva dana sam bio na Treskavici, tačnije išao sam na Đokin toranj, sa istočne Treskavice od Malog Treskaca.

    Da li neko zna čiji je bio položaj odmah uz Đokin toranj, VRS ili Armija muslimanske BiH.
    prepiska - 72734 - 14.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (1)

    O Joji Tintoru


    Špiro, od političara su lošiji ljudi samo novinari. Da li je Joja Tintor ubio čoveka, ili to nije bio čovek ni do podne, utvrdice istraga.

    Vrlo prljavo, mediji su krenuli u linč sa nesretnim Jojom, kao eto Karadžićeve ubice. Joja je mirno radio svoj posao, novinari pripisuju "šali"... a čikalo mu je pomenuo familiju.. . !

    U Crnu Goru psuju oca. Za majku ili sestru, jezičavom gine pola familije! Sada ga mediji prave monstrumom, a verovatno je uradio nešto što bi i uradila i većina nas.

    Pored toga, rat je čoveku skratio fitilj na minimum minimuma. Na ulicama se nalazi na hiljade nas sa nultom tolerancijom. Onaj teret Čelarov stiska mnoge. Kažu ljudi.. "potamo se jado, potamo se..."

    Pozdrav
    srebrenica_arg - 72732 - 13.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit,USA - best (2)

    Činjenice o Srebrenici - bačena rukavica


    Pišu Aleksandar Pavić i Stefan Karganović, jul 7, 2011 Veliki deo istine o ratnim događanjima u Srebrenici još uvek nije utvrđen. U interesu je međunarodnih faktora i mnogih lokalnih igrača da te činjenice nikada ne budu razjašnjene da bi se prikrila njihova vlastita odgovornost i da bi se lažna konstrukcija događaja mogla koristiti kao moćan politički instrument za ucenu Srbije i Republike Srpske i kao sredstvo za demoralizaciju srpskog naroda u celini. Bliži se 11. juli, godišnjica ulaska srpskih snaga u Srebrenicu 1995. godine. Iskustvo govori da će, kao i svake godine, na taj datum, kao i uoči njega, građani Srbije - (i skoro celog eks-Ju prostora) biti izloženi baražnoj paljbi propagandnih tvrdnji o "genocidu" počinjenog u to vreme, i brojki, presuda i "svedočenja" koje te tvrdnje navodno treba da potkrepe. Intenzitet te paljbe treba da bude dovoljno jak i zaglušujući da nadjača sve pokušaje da se predstave činjenice koje su poslednjih godina utvrđene, a ili dovode u pitanje ili pobijaju "zvaničnu verziju" događaja u Srebrenici. Snaga psihološkog efekta U isto vreme, propagandna paljba se otvara i radi psihološkog efekta, kako bi se jedna strana - srpska - neprekidno držala u defanzivi i stalno branila od neutemeljenih optužbi da je ne samo kriva za raspad SFRJ i krvavi rat koji ga je pratio, već i da je odgovorna za najgore i najraznovrsnije zločine, uključujući, razume se, i "najveći zločin u Evropi posle Drugog svetskog rata" - kako zapadni i regionalni mediji po automatizmu kvalifikuju dešavanja u Srebrenici. Na kraju, ista propagandna paljba se koristi i da bi se na srpski narod navukla trajna hipoteka "genocidnosti", koja bi se stalno mogla koristiti za potkopavanje spoljnog i unutrašnjeg legitimiteta svake srpske države. To će pogotovo doći do izražaja u predstojećem haškom suđenju generalu Ratku Mladiću, preko kojeg će se, na osnovu u najmanje ruku sumnjivih podataka, nastojati da se učvrsti "zvanična istorija" devedesetih - i to od strane sila najodgovornijih za raspad SFRJ i rat koji je usledio. Samim naporom da se utvrdi ili spozna istina o srebreničkim dešavanjima tokom proteklih godina, rastući broj ljudi u Srbiji i u inostranstvu, uz ključnu podršku medija kao što je "Pečat", stavio je do znanja da ne prihvata takvu igru. Zato ćemo iskoristiti ovu godišnjicu da predstavimo cenjenom, rastućem auditorijumu sve što je dosad činjenično utvrđeno u vezi događaja u Srebrenici, u sažetom obliku, na jednom mestu. Najpre kao "protivotrov" propagandi kojoj smo inače konstantno izloženi, a posebno u ovo doba godine. Ali - još važnije - kao čin bacanja rukavice svim "demokratskim" medijima u Srbiji, a pogotovo onom jednom, za koji svi plaćamo pretplatu. Organizujte ravnopravnu debatu 11. jula. Pozovite nas koji predstavljamo ove činjenice na suočavanje sa onima koji već godinama imaju rezervisan medijski prostor, bez ikakvog pokrića. Omogućite da se konačno čuju obe strane priče o Srebrenici. To je "naše pravo da znamo" - i mi od njega nećemo odustati. Srebrenica - propaganda i činjenice a) Broj prikazan na spomen-ploči Memorijalnog centra u Potočarima je "8.372-" Tri tačke treba da označe da čak ni taj broj nije konačan. Prikazani broj, međutim, ne predstavlja broj utvrđenih žrtava već broj "nestalih". Kako, međutim, može da se "zna" da je broj nestalih jednak broju "žrtava genocida" ako tela još nisu pronađena i ako nisu forenzički obrađena? Odgovor - ne može. b) Broj dosad sahranjenih u Potočarima iznosi 3.749. Da li ovo, pak, predstavlja broj dosad utvrđenih žrtava? Ne. To je samo broj dosad sahranjenih za koje se tvrdi da su "žrtve genocida". Međutim, tokom 2010. godine čak su i neki muslimanski zvaničnici bili prinuđeni da tu tvrdnju dovedu u pitanje. Mirsad Tokača, predsednik Istraživačko-dokumentacionog centra iz Sarajeva, izneo je dosad nedemantovanu tvrdnju da se na spiskovima "žrtava" nalazi "500 živih Srebreničana", dok je dodatnih 70 lica na tim spiskovima stradalo na drugim mestima i u drugo vreme. Uz to, direktor Memorijalnog centra Mersed Smajlović i direktor Centra za nestala lica BiH Amor Mašović su takođe izneli da je u Potočarima sahranjeno oko 50 osoba koje su stradale još 1992. godine, a "u bliskom srodstvu" su sa onima koji se vode kao žrtve streljanja. Takođe postoje indicije da je u Potočarima sahranjen i jedan broj Srba. v) Ukupan broj tela koja su stručnjaci Haškog tribunala dosad ekshumirali u vezi sa istragom o događajima u Srebrenici iznosi najviše 1.923. Forenzička dokumentacija Tribunala govori o 3.568 "slučajeva". Međutim, to je namerno zamagljivanje činjenica, u svrhu naduvavanja stvarnog broja nađenih tela, jer jedan "slučaj" ne znači nužno i jedno telo. "Slučaj" se može odnositi i na nepotpune ostatke nekog tela, pa čak i na jednu koščicu nađenu na određenom lokalitetu. Da li, dakle, bar broj 1.923 označava ukupan broj dosad utvrđenih "žrtava genocida"? Opet - ne. U grobnicama koje su obradili forenzički stručnjaci Tribunala, nalazi se 442 tela sa povezima i ligaturama, 505 gde je smrt prouzrokovao metak, što može ukazati na streljanje, ali i na smrt tokom borbenih dejstava, 627 je stradalo od granate, mine, gelera itd, što isključuje streljanje, a u 1.583 autopsijskih izveštaja ili "slučajeva" radi se o po nekoliko kostiju. U ovoj poslednjoj kategoriji u 92,4 odsto od tih "slučajeva" forenzički stručnjaci Tribunala nisu mogli da odrede uzrok smrti, pa se na osnovu njih nikakvi pravno ili forenzički značajni zaključci ne mogu izvoditi. g) Po proceni načelnika Generalštaba armije BiH Envera Hadžihasanovića na suđenju generalu Krstiću (6. april 2001, Transkript s. 9532) u povlačenju mešovite kolone 28. Divizije iz Srebrenice za Tuzlu samo vojnika i oficira ABiH poginulo je 2.628. U izveštaju Unprofora od 17. jula 1995. godine ukupni gubici kolone se procenjuju na oko 3.000, a Karl Bilt (pregovarač Međunarodne zajednice tokom sukoba, a posle rata visoki predstavnik u BiH) u svojim memoarima ih procenjuje na oko 4.000. Implicitno mešanje mnogo većeg broja poginulih u legitimnim borbenim dejstvima sa upadljivo manjim brojem pogubljenih zarobljenika, koji nesumnjivo jesu žrtve ratnog zločina, jedan je od trikova kojim se pristalice zvanične priče služe da naduvaju cifru "žrtava genocida," mada su i tako posle 16 godina vrlo daleko od "magičnog broja" od 8.000 koji im je potreban. d) Činjenice navedene u ovoj rubrici se poklapaju sa procenama vrlo ozbiljnih zapadnih posmatrača. Amerikanac Filip Korvin, najviši civilni zvaničnik UN u BiH u vreme sukoba, godinama tvrdi da broj streljanih u Srebrenici iznosi "oko 700". Josif Bodanski, dugogodišnji ekspert za terorizam američkog Kongresa, tvrdi da je broj streljanih "nekoliko stotina". Portugalski oficir i vojni posmatrač UN u BiH, u julu 1995. godine, Karlos Martins Branko tvrdi da je "najmanje 2.000 muslimanskih boraca" stradalo - ali u borbama. Isti oficir ističe da su srpske snage ostavile prostor muslimanskoj vojsci i civilima da se povlače ka severu, što ukazuje da nije postojao nikakav plan njihovog istrebljenja - za razliku od "unapred formulisanog genocidnog plana izvršenog protiv srpskog stanovništva Krajine". Forenzički dokazi a) Utvrđivanje uzroka smrti tela ekshumiranih na širem području Srebrenice je od 1996. godine u rukama dve organizacije: Komisije za nestala lica BiH (osnovane od strane vlade Alije Izetbegovića) i ICMP - Međunarodne komisije za nestala lica, čije čelnike postavlja američki Stejt department. Od početka iskopavanja do danas, ni srpski, ni drugi nezavisni međunarodni forenzički stručnjaci nisu imali pristup forenzičkom postupku nad iskopanim telima. To znači da je svaka mogućnost nezavisne provere njihovih "nalaza" nemoguća i da je jedini način da budu prihvaćeni - na veru. b) U haškoj presudi protiv potpukovnika VRS Vujadina Popovića i ostalih (2010), navedeno je da je pomoću DNK uzoraka identifikovano "5.336" žrtava. Zagovarači zvanične priče i ovde računaju na neznanje većine ljudi o upotrebi i dometima DNK analize u kriminalističkoj praksi. DNK služi jedino da identifikuje posmrtne ostatke ili da omogući reasocijaciju delova tela iste osobe. DNK tehnologija je neupotrebljiva za određivanje uzroka i vremena smrti, što su ključne kategorije u kriminalističkoj istrazi ovakve vrste. Takođe zanimljiva je činjenica da i pored toga Tribunal zasad odbija da objavi spisak imena lica navodno identifikovanih putem DNK analize. Presude za učešće u "genocidu" a) Jedina osoba pravosnažno osuđena od strane Tribunala za neposredno učestvovanje u streljanjima u Srebrenici je Dražen Erdemović, Hrvat iz okoline Tuzle koji je u zamenu za svoja višestruko kontradiktorna i nelogična svedočenja dobio "kaznu" od ukupno dve godine zatvora za navodno učestvovanje u streljanju "1.000-1.200" muslimana, kao i promenu identiteta i preseljenje u neimenovanu zapadnu zemlju. Erdemovićeva "svedočenja" čine osnovu za celu hašku konstrukciju srebreničkih optužbi. Međutim, u Pilici, na mestu gde je Erdemović navodno učestvovao u pomenutom masovnom streljanju, dosad je nađeno ukupno 124 tela, od kojih 72 sa povezom preko očiju i/ili vezanim rukama. Bez obzira na to što materijalni dokazi na terenu demantuju Erdemovićevu priču, Tribunal u Hagu i Sud BiH u Sarajevu i dalje na njoj temelje svoje presude i izriču višedecenijske kazne. b) Pored Erdemovića, ključni svedoci saradnici Tribunala koji su dali lažne izjave o činjenicama i zauzvrat dobili blažu kaznu su Momir Nikolić i Miroslav Deronjić. Nikolić je izmislio priču o "prekopavanjima" i "sekundarnim grobnicama" da bi tužilaštvu Haškog tribunala obezbedio koliko-toliko uverljivo objašnjenje zašto je broj pronađenih tela streljanih zarobljenika u tolikoj meri podbacio u odnosu na unapred razglašenu cifru od 8.000. Kada se sporazumevao sa Tužilaštvom i da bi mu se dodvorio, Nikolić je čak izmislio i pripisao sebi dva ubistva koja je kasnije pod unakrsnim ispitivanjem priznao da nije počinio. Deronjić je svoj "iskaz o činjenicama" uslužno menjao osam puta u skladu sa potrebama Tužilaštva u raznim predmetima u kojima je svedočio. v) Od ostalih pravosnažno osuđenih za zločine u Srebrenici, u julu 1995. godine - svi su osuđeni po načelu "komandne odgovornosti" (po kojem se može osuditi praktično svako u komandom lancu vojske za bilo koje delo, bez obzira na to da li je izdao naredbu ili ne, ili čak znao da se ono počinilo). Primera radi, komandant Drinskog korpusa general Radislav Krstić osuđen je na 35 godina zatvora, iako je samo Sudsko veće istaklo da on nije proveo više od jednog sata na području dešavanja, da nije izdao nikakvu komandu za streljanja i da je pred zauzimanje Srebrenice izdao naređenje da se civili i vojni zarobljenici tretiraju u skladu sa odredbama Ženevske konvencije. S druge strane, komandant muslimanskih snaga Naser Orić oslobođen je svih optužbi, iako su njegove snage odgovorne za smrt više hiljada Srba na tom prostoru između 1992. i 1995. godine. Dokazi za predumišljaj u "planiranju genocida" a) Do dan-danas ne postoji nijedan dokaz kojim raspolaže Tribunal, tj. nijedna naredba koja bi ukazala da je nekakav "genocid" u Srebrenici planiran ili naređen. Ali zato, npr. postoji naređenje generala Tolimira komandi zarobljeničkog logora Batković blizu Bijeljine da se pripremi za dolazak oko 1.200 srebreničkih zarobljenika, što otprilike odgovara broju muslimana iz kolone koje je zarobila VRS i ubedljivo dovodi u pitanje postojanje u najvišim strukturama VRS plana za njihovo pogubljenje, a kamoli za "genocid." b) Takođe, nije ustanovljena nikakva povezanost u komandnom lancu VRS sa streljanjima koja su se bez sumnje desila u okolini Srebrenice (od strane dosad još uvek neutvrđenih počinilaca, ako se izuzmu Erdemović i još nekoliko pripadnika njegove misteriozne jedinice, 10. diverzantskog odreda, koje je on imenovao i uhapšeni su tek nedavno, 15 godina posle događaja, uprkos činjenici da je vlastima odavno poznato ko su i gde se nalaze). Erdemović je u svedočenjima pominjao tajanstvenog "pukovnika" koji je navodno izdao naredbu za streljanje, ali takva osoba nije dosad ni imenovana, ni pouzdano identifikovana. v) Sama vojna jedinica koja se spominje kao izvršilac masovnih streljanja, 10. diverzantski odred, nije se formacijski nalazila u strukturama VRS. Ta jedinica je bila višenacionalna (sastavljena od Srba, Hrvata, muslimana, čak i jednog Slovenca) i neki od njenih pripadnika su se kasnije borili kao plaćenici u Africi, pod komandom zapadne vojske. Pravna kvalifikacija događaja Još jedan trik koji koriste propagandisti zvanične priče o Srebrenici je da je to činjenica koju nije utvrdio samo jedan međunarodni sud (Haški tribunal), već dva (i Međunarodni sud pravde u tužbi BiH protiv Savezne Republike Jugoslavije, odnosno Srbije). Po ustaljenom obrascu, oni nude lažan argumenat znajući da većina ljudi nema mogućnost da ga proveri. Haški tribunal je, pre svega, ad hok politički sud koji u većini slučajeva goni samo jednu stranu - Srbe, koji su dobili oko 90 odsto od ukupnih godina kazne koje je taj sud izrekao. Taj podatak dovoljno govori o njegovoj profesionalnoj ozbiljnosti i nepristrasnosti kao pravosudnog organa. Što se tiče Međunarodnog suda pravde, on uopšte nije samostalno istraživao srebreničke događaje nego je prosto preuzeo zaključke Tribunala. Pa i tako, Srbiju je oslobodio svake odgovornosti za "genocid" u Srebrenici, a to je činjenica koju zagovarači srebreničke priče, kada se pozivaju na presudu ovog suda, uvek namerno propuštaju da pomenu. Status Srebrenice uoči jula 1995. Mada proglašena zaštićenom zonom UN, još u aprilu 1993. godine srebrenička enklava nikada nije, kako je sporazum od 17.4.1993. godine nalagao, demilitarizovana. Na primer, generalni sekretar UN u izveštaju od 16.3. 1994. godine navodi da Armija Vlade BiH koristi bezbedne zone "kao lokacije gde njene snage mogu da se odmaraju, obučavaju i opremaju, kao i da otvaraju vatru na srpske položaje, tako izazivajući srpsku odmazdu". Drugim rečima, da bi se stekla objektivna slika o Srebrenici potrebno je uzeti u obzir ne samo događaje koji su se odigrali za tri dana u julu 1995. godine, već i iz trogodišnjeg perioda koji je tome prethodio. U tom periodu, više od pedeset srpskih sela spaljenih oko Srebrenice u pogromima vojnih formacija iz enklave pod zaštitom UN i oko hiljadu pobijenih srpskih civila oba pola uzrasta od 12 do preko 80 godina (a ne samo vojnosposobnih muškaraca, kao u julu 1995) predstavlja jezivi bilans operativne delatnosti Armije BiH pod komandom Nasera Orića. Na vrhuncu svoje moći u enklavi Orić je francuskom generalu Filipu Morijonu drsko izjavio da "on nema vremena za uzimanje zarobljenika." Zato nije ni čudo što je na suđenju Slobodanu Miloševiću Morijon posvedočio o svom "strahu da će se Srbi, lokalni Srbi, osvetiti za svoje mrtve i za sve što im je Orić učinio" (Transkript, s. 31975). Oni koji bacaju bumerang snose i deo odgovornosti za štetu koju im u povratku učini. Istina i poraz propagande Veliki deo osnovnih činjenica vezanih za Srebrenicu još uvek preostaje da se utvrdi. U interesu je međunarodnih faktora i mnogih lokalnih igrača da te činjenice nikada ne budu razjašnjene da bi se prikrila njihova vlastita odgovornost i da bi se lažna konstrukcija događaja Srebrenica mogla koristiti kao moćan politički instrument za ucenu Srbije i Republike Srpske i kao sredstvo za demoralizaciju srpskog naroda u celini. Zato su poštena istraga i potpuna istina o Srebrenici ono na čemu mi insistiramo. A baš od toga propagandisti diskreditovane srebreničke "genocidne" priče sistematski beže. Oni znaju da je ovo debata koju mogu da dobiju pod samo jednim uslovom: da su svi njihovi protivnici isključeni iz javne rasprave i primorani da ćute. Ali toga više nikada neće biti. Oni su kontrolu nad srebreničkim diskursom nepovratno izgubili.
    dobra_knjiga - 72726 - 13.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenović Detroit, USA - best (1)

    Srebrenica: falsifikovanje istorije


    Knjiga "Srebrenica: falsifikovanje istorije" u izdanju Stefana Karganovića, predsednik nevladine organizacije "Istorijski projekat Srebrenica", na zahtjev Federacije BiH, a po odluci komisije BiH i UN, zabranjena je za uvoz i distribuciju na području cele BiH.

    Ova knjiga javnosti nudi nove argumente, činjenice i brojke o žrtvama u događajima oko Srebrenice pa tako javnosti daje prikaz ove priče sa jednog naučnog stanovišta. Ova knjiga ruši "srebrenički mit" pa su se muslimanski centri moći i njihovi sponzori, međunarodna zajednica, uplašili da će njihov projekat propasti.

    KNjIGA "Srebrenica: falsifikovanje istorije" je zbornik kritičkih eseja vezanih za dešavanja u Srebrenici u julu 1995. godine, i u njoj su objavljene studije američkog profesora Edvarda Hermana i grupe stranih autora, kao i domaćih autora koji gledaju kritički na ta dešavanja.

    Zabranjivanje ove knjige još je jedan dokaz njihove nemoći. Zabrana knjige podsjeća na srednjovekovnu inkviziciju i spaljivanje knjiga.
    montevideo - 72725 - 13.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (1)

    Upisivanje u pravoslavlje


    rat_sarajevo - 72724 - 13.08.2012 : Ratko Obrenovic Detroit, USA - best (0)

    Vijest iz 2009. godine ali još uvijek aktuelna


    programi - 72678 - 13.08.2012 : Jelena Stevanovic Sabac - best (1)

    Windows media player


    Imam prolem, hoću da gledam TV kanale preko interneta međutim na nekim kanalima piše da je potreban Windows Media Player. Kada skinem taj program kanal neće da startuje, pa vas pitam kako startuje taj windows pleyer, Unapred hvala!

    Jelena,

    Kao prvo, trebala si da mi napišeš koju verziju programa koristiš. Ipak, pokušaj da uradiš sledeće:

    1. Startuj Medija Centar i otiđi na Tasks-Settings-General-Automatic Download opciju

    2. Izaberi obje opcije koje su tu prikazana. Ovo će da drži tvoje online programe ažurirane.

    3. Klikni na "Download Now" i pričekaj da dobiješ poruku "download completed. Nakon toga ćeš biti u stanju ga gledaš Internet TV.

    Ako ti ovo ne pomogne otiđi na Tasks-Settings-General-Windows Media Center Setup-Run Setup Again a zatim izaberi "custom setup".

    Kada je setap završen idi na "Auto download options" i klikni "download" da skineš Internet TV Guide.
    prepiska - 72672 - 12.08.2012 : Novak Alimpić Beograd - best (1)

    Odgovor posetiocima


    Za Irinu Oblak,

    pozdrav, slavim Đurđevdan "hajdučki sastanak"

    pozdrav za Veka i bilećke jurišnike, i pitanje jel živ ludi Beki?

    za Elmira Sarajliju
    Bogu hvala te više nema "Juge", kasno si zaplakao za njom, vama muslimanima je bila raj, nama Srbima teska grobnica.. . Šta ti fali?Đamija imaš na svakom koraku, pritegla vas seljačka cokula Šiptara i Sandžaklija... A tu su i engleske vehabije. Kako Alija reče treba samo Srbe oterati i raj u Bosni. Đenet beše? Sada nema para ni u vas ni u nas, sve u lihvara ruku. A i bolje je da nema! Kad smo siti i podnapiti tražimo belaja. Bolji smo ljudi kad su nam džepovi prazni no puni. Zaslužili smo i gore od ovoga, veruj mi... Kada su nam džepovi puni, tad smo silni i prepametni, boga psujemo na svakom koraku. Kad su nam džepovi bušni, jao bože ovo jao bože ono... Ko je bre na Balkanu zaslužio da živi dobro i lagodno? Nije to za nas već za Šveđane!
    treskavica - 72662 - 12.08.2012 : Focak Sarajevo - best (0)

    Proskok, juli 1993. godine


    Vidim da ovdje pišu i pripadnici VRS i pripadnici ARBiH, pa bih zamolio ako neko može da malo detaljnije objasni događaje oko Proskoka, a koji su se desili krajem jula 1993. godine. Prije svega interesuju me objektivni i istiniti stavovi. I ja sam bio vojnik, i jedina želja mi je da na ovom mjestu razmjenimo iskustva iz prošlog rata.




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